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Old December 8th, 2002, 09:56 PM
von von is offline
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Default Can you say "Lawsuit"

Is anyone else out there interested in a class-action lawsuit against Carnival? It bad enough that they didn't refund our money, and it's six days after we docked and I still have the squirts. Apparently bottom dollar and not customer relations is their concern. Are they that stupid? Word of mouth goes a long way . Everybody I talk to(friends,relatives,co-workers,health-care workers,etc) cannot believe that we did not at least get a refund! I'm not sure what we are going to do yet. I have my hands full with a sick father right now, but we will explore out options. I would like to gather a master list of sick passengers, if interested , please leave your EMAIL.
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Old December 8th, 2002, 10:15 PM
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Default Re: Can you say "Lawsuit"

Von, I'm sure you will find enough "suers" out there to fullfill your plan.
My next door neighbors are both sick. Do you think I can sue them if I get sick?
Maybe Carnival should sue the passengers who got sick for being the ones who brought the "virus" aboard?? Sounds fair to me.
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Old December 8th, 2002, 10:30 PM
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Default Re: Re: Can you say "Lawsuit"

This disease is not tranmitted person -to-person. It is transmitted through food contamination. 75% of the victims came from our dining room. That is why I hold Carnival responsible.
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Old December 9th, 2002, 06:43 AM
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Default Re: Can you say "Lawsuit"

If you are talking Norwalk-like virus, it IS transmitted person to person, not through the food......check out the CDC website if you have any doubts about that.

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Old December 9th, 2002, 08:40 AM
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Default Re: Can you say "Lawsuit"

GET OVER IT! Going to court will make you even sicker!
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Old December 9th, 2002, 10:14 AM
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Default Re: Re: Can you say "Lawsuit"

Lisa, you are WRONG! Look at the CDC Website! The only way you can transfer from person to person is by "close contact with infected persons(for example, by sharing food,water or eating utensils). Individuals may also become infected by eating or drinking comtaminated foods or beverages." The CDC also goes on to say: "Food may be contaminated by food preparers or handlers who have the viral gastroenteritis, especially if they do not wash their hands regularly after using the bathroom. "

Well, since my husband and I did not share utensils or food with the other passengers, and
Since 75% of passenger victims came from the Sensation Dining Room, I have to wonder if it was a food handler there? I would like to know which crew members were ill, I'll bet any money they were food handlers from the Sensation Dining Room.

At the dinner table, the waiter dropped a roll onto the table and picked it up with hands and put it back into the basket! What happens behind the scenes in the kitchen?
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Old December 9th, 2002, 12:34 PM
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Default Re: Can you say

Paaallllleeeeaaaasssse!

If we can sue for that, can they sue for seasickness since that is the fault of the ship ... or is it the ocean? Who do you see for a lawsuit to the ocean?

Victims always bring out the best in this board!
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Old December 9th, 2002, 01:03 PM
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Default Re: Can you say "Lawsuit"

This is just plain dumb now folks. The 'stomache flu' has been around forever and you are still more likely to get it while home than on a ship. Think about it, almost half the population of the USA will contract this illness each and every year, less than 10% of ship passengers have contracted it even on those few ships, (you can count them on one hand), that have had major problems. It is a very contagious virus and easily passed around and around. Get over the idea of making money for any problem you have in your life that is just part of living for crying out loud. CCL is no more responsible than was RCI, HAL, NCL, P&O, or Celebrity. In addition this illness runs it's course in no more than 72 hours, usually 48 so someone is obviously suffering from something else or are passing the infection back and forth between them and their family and/or friends. maybe they should sue you? Come on folks, can we please be reasonable about this and put it in it's proper perspective? Yes it is a really nasty thing to catch and really makes one miserable to say the least, but come on, it is common and not the fault of any cruiseline or airline, (which is most likely where many are catching it!), or anyone else, it just happens.
Jim



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Old December 9th, 2002, 01:26 PM
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Default Re: Can you say

Do the math. The Fascination holds 2050 guests and 920 staff - totaling 2970 people. Only 190 were ailing on your ship - that's only 6.5% of the people on board. I'm sure they didn't all have the Norwalk virus either. People tend to freak out and label a seasickness or a bad hangover as the Norwalk virus or something else. How many of these people drank the water or ate at some local restaurant? There are just too many variables to assume that 6.5% of the people on your ship got the Norwalk virus.

But sue away if you want. I assume you'll also be a part of the McDonalds Made Me Fat lawsuit.
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Old December 9th, 2002, 02:07 PM
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Default Re: Re: Can you say "Lawsuit"

I wouln't even be thinking about it if Carnival had stepped up and done the right thing (as other lines have done) and offered those sick in the infermary a refund. I still have not had a solid bowel movement (without going into gross detail) since last Sunday. I finished up a course of Cipro from my doc yesterday in hopes to stop the squirts, no luck. I think sometimes these companies need to be held accountable for their obvious negligence. Common, some lazy cook, went to the bathroom, and didn't wash , contaminating food. Do the math, of those sick, 75% came from the same dining room,, what does that tell you? IT WAS IN THE FOOD. They need to train and nag their staff so it does not happen again. I feel especially bad for the eldery victims who had a rougher time. I'm not one of those people 'out for a buck', and to prove it, if I do end up with a law suit, I am in no need for money, I would seriously consider donating ALL IT to a charity! When we were leaving the boat, there were people thowing up in buckets on the stairwells! I'll bet alot more never made it to the infirmery because they didn't get sick till Monday.
Carnival never informed us of what was going on. On Sat, I overheard our cabin neighbors talking about their sick children. Shouln't the sick have been quaranteened to stop further spread? I don't think they know how to handle this when it happens. And as far as the medical care goes, on Tues afternoon, at my Doctors, I still had a fever. Carnival never even took my temp at all! They gave me a shot in the but to stop the vomiting, and never swiped my skin with alcohol first! It happened so fast, and I was sick, I didn't react fast enough to stip the shot.
Yeh, bottom line I'm pissed off my vacation was ruined, and that I'm still sick, and that my husband had to lose 2 more days of work, but it had to be negligence on Carnival's part infecting the food or ice (the ice machines were not working properly and they had coolers with scoop - the handle rested IN the ice), and they should at least refund us sick passengers!
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Old December 9th, 2002, 03:16 PM
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Default Re: Can you say "Lawsuit"

Calm down and shut up, i think that will work...... How about you???
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Old December 9th, 2002, 04:28 PM
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Default Re: Re: Re: Can you say "Lawsuit"

Von....

I imagine the reason you have "the squirts" is because of the medication CIPRO!!!! There are several things you should have been told about Cipro, one of the main ones being that it can cause "the squirts". Also to take it 2 hours before or after consuming antacids, iron or dairy products.

I am not sure why they gave you Cipro in the first place....an antibiotic will not help a virus!

Anyway, hope you're feeling better!

Cathy

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Old December 9th, 2002, 04:55 PM
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Default Re: Can you say "Lawsuit"

You're a riot Von and hope you get over your "squirts" soon! I can't believe you really feel that Carnival OWES you a free cruise!!!
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Old December 9th, 2002, 05:23 PM
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Default Re: Can you say "Lawsuit"

Actually von, according to the CDC, it is person to person -- only when the server didn't wash their hands correctly before handling food is it transmitted through food -- and if you research gastroenteritis (which the Norwalk-like virus is), you'll see that the only food that can really "hold" the virus are shellfish and specifically oysters.

We live in such a litigious society, I find the knee-jerk reaction to sue rather sad and pathetic. This is a common virus found anywhere many people gather in confined spaces (ie. nursing homes, camps, schools, cruise ships, etc.) that was originally carried onto the ship by a passenger...so says the CDC and I believe them...the virus may (but this isn't proven) be able to live on inanimate objects like handrails, etc. and therefore be picked up by the next person to touch the area. Hence the suggestions to wash your hands and don't put your hands in your mouth. And I personally like the idea of taking some Clorox wipes for the cabin and hand sanitizer -- why not?

Furthermore, I'm very impressed that you somehow managed to talk to 75% of the sick people -- that must have been some vacation...first you get sick and then you set out to sue. Are you a lawyer? Because I can't think of anyone else sounding this ridiculous (my apologies to any good lawyers who do their research out there!) -- you obviously don't know what you're talking about because the research shows the opposite of what you claim....and I find the claim that you talked to 75% of the people in "our" dining room to be questionable at best because a) there is only one dining room and b) that means that while you yourself were ill, you would have had to determine the exact number of sick people and searched out and talked to 75% of them, which I doubt you did. Especially since in your original email you ask for other sick passengers to contact you -- if you talked to them, you'd have their contact info if this was a serious threat you're making.

My suggestion to you is to chalk it up to bad luck and let it go -- drink fluids, take care of yourself and your family and move on man....life's too short to get bogged down in such inanity. Go do something positive. (And don't ever travel to the Amazon rain forest or Africa -- some diseases in those places can kill you.)

- Amanda
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Old December 9th, 2002, 07:03 PM
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Default Re: Re: Re: Can you say "Lawsuit"

You are wrong! According to a great deal of info on the internet you can transmit it from person to person. I live in Missouri and got it from a family friend on Thanksgiving along with 10 other people. This is not Carnival's fault or any cruise lines fault. It is a nasty virus that spreads like wildfire and it is just bad luck anyone got it. Filing a law suit is ridiculous and it is people like you that have caused so much legal crap in the country. Enough said.
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Old December 9th, 2002, 07:29 PM
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Default Re: Can you say "Lawsuit"

Get over it "Squirty"!! This is the most ridiculous proposed lawsuit that I have heard of in quite awhile.
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Old December 9th, 2002, 07:51 PM
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Default Re: Re: Can you say "Lawsuit"

The scent of money has trickeled into the water-----now the sharks are starting to circle.

Von, I think you can see how the majority of people feel. Had you tripped over a mop buckett that had been left on the stairs, etc, etc, and suffered a broken arm or such, then I'm sure no one here would say a word about your proposed suit.

But to blame a cruise line for allegedly getting sick with this so called virus is beyond ridiculous. There are hundreds of ways the virus could have come on board.
Assume you had several people over for Thanksgiving dinner and one got sick with the flu, then proceeded to sue you. What would be your response--

I am serious--I wish the cruise lines , instead of paying up, could file suits of their own against people like you.
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Old December 9th, 2002, 08:08 PM
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Default Re: Can you say "Lawsuit"

Antibiotics are not effective against viruses, so whoever the genius was that prescribed Cipro to you was an idiot; Cipro as an antibiotic can cause something called C-Difficle which is diarrhea caused by the killing off of the good bacteria in the intestines by an antibiotic!!!! (yes, there are such things as good bacteria and viruses!) I think you more than contributed to your own illness and to sue the cruise line is absolutely ridiculous....others have borne me out on my post about norwalk-like virus being passed person to person......get over it, hope you get better soon and stop blaming everyone else for your problems.

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Old December 10th, 2002, 05:41 AM
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Default Re: Can you say "Lawsuit"

And who "forced" you to take the cruise?
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Old December 10th, 2002, 06:17 AM
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Default Re: Can you say "Lawsuit"

Do the math Von. 99.9% of us are telling you to get over it! Life is to short to worry about a vacation that did not live up to your expectations. There will be other vacations and hopefully for you, they will be more enjoyable. Hope you feel better soon.
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Old December 10th, 2002, 07:10 AM
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Default Re: Can you say "Lawsuit"

I can't see a lawsuit simply because you've had "the squirts" for a week. Good luck.
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Old December 10th, 2002, 07:13 AM
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Default Re: Re: Can you say "Lawsuit"

Hey, here's an idea...sue Robert Vaughn. He seems to have become the spokesman for the National Association of Shysters & Ambulance Chasers. It is no coincidence that shyster sounds like a German scatological term.

Also, an example of good bacteria someone mentioned previously is none other than E. Coli. E is for Escaricha (if I remember my spelling correctly), Coli is the possessive form of the Latin term for colon. The organism only lives in the lower G.I. of animals where it secretes enzymes critical to digestion. The trick is that each individual can only tolerate his own E. Coli.

Wash those hands!

Steve
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Old December 10th, 2002, 07:15 AM
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Default Re: Re: Can you say "Lawsuit"

Von are you going to sew the airline also if you flew? Or the bus or the taxi that you might have ridden on your way to the cruise? Did you shop before your cruise or while you were in port? Are all these people also in your law suitl
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Old December 10th, 2002, 09:44 AM
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Default Re: Re: Re: Can you say "Lawsuit"

Von, Von, Von:

Most people will eat in the dining room at least once during their cruise. Assuming that because 75% of the people that were sick ate in the dining room during one point in their cruise attributed to the Norwalk virus is just silly.

Also - in previous posts you adamantly stated that this virus cannot be spread through person to person contact, yet in your reply to my post you stated that Carnival should have quarantied all of the sick people. If people (according to you) can't spread this virus, then why the quarantine? I believe you are just searching for things to complain about.

I'm also confused about the need for you to take Cipro for a virus. You do realize that Cipro does not cure a virus, right?
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Old December 10th, 2002, 10:38 AM
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Lisa is right on...wait until their lawyers find out you to an antibiotic for a supposed viral infection!!! No wonder you still have problems. Perhaps you should sue the doctor who must be a total idiot.
Von..get over it as everyone has told you. Big deal..you got an intestinal virus. Everyone gets them...do you sue the school when your kids get one???
Move on.
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Old December 10th, 2002, 12:05 PM
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Dam, I sure caused a stir here? I cannot believe that any of you do not think that those who became ill do not deserve a refund! You must all be shareholders or something!

Here in Pittsburgh, I am receiving the exact opposite sentiment. All of my family,friends,coworkers, and even the Doctors and Nurses who were taking care of my father at the hospital cannot believe that Carnival has not even offerred another cruise(they could offer me 100 of them and I will never go again) yet alone a refund. That is why I will probably have to go the legal route!

And as far as the Cipro goes, We still have not been officially notified on what has ailed us. Norwalk is only an assumtion. I went to my Doc on Tues, and who knows what caused our symptoms? As far as we know, it could be bacterial! He gave me a script for Cipro and said if I still had symptoms in a couple of days, take it. Well as of Thurs evening I did (thats 5 days of constant diahrea people). I lost another couple of pounds overnight (that may be the only positive out of this). Since the Cipro was no help (symptoms same), it must be viral. I guess I'm just one of the unlucky ones who's taking longer to get rid of this(my husband is fine now).

And as far as washing hands goes, I am one of the biggest 'germaphobes' out there. When my dad was just admitted before I left (hip prob-not to serious), I wiped down his whole room with Clorox wipes and made him use antibacterial wipes on his hands befor eating. I carry antibacterial wipes and Purell in my purse and I always wash my hands thoroughly after using the bathroom! On the ship, we even made sure we used the bathroom in our cabin only! You can was your hands all you want, but if your food preparer doesn't, you're screwed! The ship was filled with foreigners who some barely spoke English, what backass third-world country are some of them from that they are not used to practicing good hygeine? I think the cabin Stewards get paid $45/week plus tips! You must be bad off to accept that! (In researching, I came across a lawsuit by one against Carnival because he became ill, lost work, and Carnival would only pay him the $45, not the assumed tips he lost (which are automatically added to your bill), but that's a whole other issue I don't care about).

The disease is transmitted Fecal - Oral route only. According to the CDC and other research studies I came across, state that it is only a POSSIBILITY aof being transmitted airborne. Acording to CDC, settings of outbreaks are as follows:
Foodborne-39%,Waterborne-3%,person-to-person(such as sharing utensils,etc)-12%,unknown-18%,no data 28%.

If cases due go to court, details will have to come out. We can only make assumtions at this point. Carnival is not going to release anything that they don't have to. I think that where the crew members were employed will have great importance. If they all turn out to be food handlers (especially salad preparers), that will say something.

Nonetheless , I am done here. This message board is filled with cruiselovers,shareholders,employees probably. I cannot believe that I live in a different world here in Pittsburgh where I am surrounded by support. Would your opinions change if Carnival/Holland Amer only continue to have problem? Only time will tell...
Anyway, good luck on all your cruisin'....

Peace out.
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Old December 10th, 2002, 12:24 PM
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Default Re: Re: Re: Re: Can you say "Lawsuit"

Hummmm. You last two words of your post speak volumes! We have had a youngster who claims to be 14 yrs old male on the chat recently that has been somewhat confrontational at times and making some obviously uninformed remarks and statements. It is quite interesting that this person, (and I have rarely seen this phrase ever used and never here before), uses the exact same phrase to end his time posting and you infer that you are a female and adult! <VBG> Seems that we can safely put this thread to rest now.
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Old December 10th, 2002, 12:33 PM
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Default Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Can you say "Lawsuit"

What? I am a 36WF, who got that phrase watching the Rosie O'donnell show! Your sentiment in your past messages makes me wonder if you're a Carnival CEO!
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Old December 10th, 2002, 12:43 PM
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Default Re: Can you say "Lawsuit"

“First thing we do, let’s kill all the lawyers.”
--William Shakespeare

“The only thing I expect out of lawyers is that they be back in their coffins by sunup.”

--F. Ross Johnson,
former CEO, RJR
Nabisco

“I used to be a lawyer, but now I am a reformed character.”
--Woodrow Wilson

The questions of fairness, fault or legal liability matter little in this type of case. Lawyers will urge thier clients to sue and the cruise lines will settle to avoid the cost of a prolonged court battle. What do you expect from a profession that encourages obese teens to sue McDonalds because they are overweight? It doesn't matter in the least that morally and legally McDonalds is, by any fair standard, not responsible for the little gluttons excesses. Yet , in the end, McDonalds will probably pay to get the lawyers off their back. And so it goes...


Yes I do dislike lawyers. Sue me!



Post Edited (12-10-02 12:45)
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Old December 10th, 2002, 01:18 PM
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Default Re: Re: Can you say

Yes Doug, I do agree with you, I too think that most lawyers are scum, but sometimes for justice, they are necessary. I am being very cautious when speaking to them, I understand their priorities. I would not compare this to McDonalds though, I honestly feel that their may be some negligence here, and that can only be determined by a thorough investigation.

I really hope I don't have to pursue legal action, that will be up to Carnival. So far , NO ONE HAS CONTACTED ME AS THEY SAID THEY WOULD! I'm sure that's probably because of their LEGAL DEPARTMENT , because then that could be admitted fault.

I just wish I knew what this was! They have concluded nothing so far. On Tue , when I went to my Doc, I had no clue! Nausea,vomiting,diahrea,severe headache, muscle aches, for all I knew it was meningitis or something! My head hurt so bad, probably from dehydration. I'm trying to drink as much water as I can.

Like I said, the possibility does exist for fault by Carnival employees. Anyone that can automatically dismiss that possibility is biased (Maybe a worried stockholder?)Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.......

Yes, I have deep pockets and I'm pissed, look ou!
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