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  #1 (permalink)  
Old March 2nd, 2004, 01:45 PM
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Default The Truth about Tipping

It is not Tipping, It Is a SERVICE FEE

Tipping...its not tipping anymore. Tipping was orginated to give to a person whos service you felt were above the norm. It appears that tipping is now expected, whether the service is good or bad. Everyone has a hand out....Give me, Give me, Give me, I dont get tips eveytime I do a good Job...

Anyway tipping should be at your discression. If the cruise lines don't pay their employees, they should make a big sign stating.....

"WE ARE CHEAP, SO PLEASE WORK HARD AND GIVE OUR EMPLOYEES YOU MONEY SO WE DONT HAVE TO".

Tipping should never never never be expected. It should be given if you feel the service you recieved was of satisfaction to you and your needs.

I tip all the time, but I will never tip if some tells me I have to. Earn it first !!!!!!

It's is not Tipping, It Is a SERVICE FEE ....
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Old March 2nd, 2004, 01:56 PM
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Default Re: The Truth about Tipping

If you choose to tip, err, pay the service fee, up front at the time of booking, do they still charge, or expect, tips at the bars?
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Old March 2nd, 2004, 02:09 PM
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Default Re: The Truth about Tipping

Yes, i agree with you Tipmaster. But i think the way
Carnival does it is as a convenience to both passengers
and workers. The only exception is when bad service
is provided, it's a hassle to reduce or eliminate the tip.
Also if Carnival didn't auto-deduct service fees then
they would have to pay their workers more money
and charge us passengers more money. So either
way you are going to pay. It comes down to what
is most efficient and easiest for all.
Scott
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Old March 2nd, 2004, 03:07 PM
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Default Re: The Truth about Tipping

Hi Jt,
They will automatically add a 15% tip on your bar drink, so you don't need to tip extra.

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Old March 2nd, 2004, 03:31 PM
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Default Re: Re: The Truth about Tipping

Bar tips are not part of the pretip charge you get put on your card for the cabin stewart, dining crew and misc altern dining. Drinks as already said include their own 15% tip each time you sign for it.
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Old March 2nd, 2004, 03:37 PM
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Default Re: The Truth about Tipping

Scott's right - you'll pay somewhere, somehow - just a matter of when and how. So don't tip, but if enough people follow your lead, we will all pay more up front.

dorothy

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Old March 2nd, 2004, 03:37 PM
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Default Re: The Truth about Tipping

Thats what I figured, thanks!
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Old March 2nd, 2004, 03:51 PM
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Default Re: The Truth about Tipping

Tipping is still optional, though Carnival will place your tips on the sail & sign card. You can ask that it be removed.

Carnival employees, as well as other cruise lines, do calculate their approx. income before signing on and deciding whether they want to work as hard as they do to earn that income.

Those who think the cruise lines should simply pay their employees that wage to begin with, are asking Carnival to increase the price of their ticket. Either way passengers PAY IT!

At least in the present system you can reduce the "trip" if you feel you got poor service. If you were paying these monies directly ,in your cruise fare, it's gone.

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Old March 2nd, 2004, 04:51 PM
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Default Re: The Truth about Tipping

I had come across somewhere that TIP is an acronym for 'To Insure Promptness'. Now just hope that this pre-tipping does not cause just the opposite effect.
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Old March 2nd, 2004, 04:56 PM
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Default Re: The Truth about Tipping

Many people work for tips. I am a waitress. i receive a wage paid by my boss of $2.33 per hour. I work my buns off to make sure I can make a descent wage. I hate it when someone says they have to earn that tip. Hey we do work for it. As do the cruise ship employees. Dont' be so cheap! I love you customers who think when you give me that $2 on a $50 dollar dinner check that youhave done your duty to tipping. Time to wake up everyone..... If you cant afford to tip you shouldnt go out to eat or go on a cruise. We as the servers just figure you cant afford it. So we feel sorry for you that you are so poor. I am sure you wouldnt do that to us on purpose! Oh maybe you cant figure what 20% of the total is??? How sad you are just not very smart. I am not trying to be mean.. but as a worker for tips we see it all....... We work for tips. Just like the cruise lines employees... Happy cruising...
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Old March 2nd, 2004, 06:43 PM
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Default Re: Re: The Truth about Tipping

i totally agree. as a server i believe its just embarrassing if a customer doesn't know how to tip. and by the way the standard used to be 10% but i believe 15% is the standard nowadays. we only make $2.15 an hour
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Old March 2nd, 2004, 07:14 PM
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Default Re: The Truth about Tipping

As a former member of the service industry, I understand the frustration of working for $2.13 an hour and depending on the graciousness of others for my living. That said, however, I do not feel that a tip should be required. It should always be at the discretion of the patron, and should be in direct proportion to how well said patron was treated at the establishment. To say that people should always leave 15-20% is absurd. I know that there are instances in which good service has been provided and the tip does not measure up. I also know that is sucks when that happens. In those cases, perhaps they can't afford more than that. You shouldn't be insulted that someone left you the most generous tip they could afford to leave you. Poor people should be permitted to go out to dinner. Or perhaps they were not raised to tip because their parents did not know any better. It sucks, and I used to get mad, too, but as I have matured I see it a little differently. Generally speaking, though, when I received a $2 tip on a $50 check, I had done something wrong and did not deserve 15%. So yes, some people do stiff you on purpose. Rather than consider it a sign of inferior intelligence, consider the possibility that maybe, just maybe, you gave inferior service or had an inferior attitude. How sad that you think you're entitled to 15-20% from every table, regardless of the level of service provided.

Regarding "Pretipping" on cruises, I understand why they do it, but it should not be required. I have not been on a cruise, and am hoping that employees will still go to lengths to make the customers happy even though they are virtually guaranteed a tip. I would be happier if they went ahead and called it a "service fee," as stated in the original post.
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Old March 2nd, 2004, 09:35 PM
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Default Re: The Truth about Tipping

It will never bother me to have have "pre-tipping" on our sign and sail card. Both my husband and myself are blue collar workers and find it a blessing that we have been on two cruises. We count every penny but will never overlook those who work hard to help us enjoy our stay on the ship. I don't know how long this prepaid tipping has been implemented on Carnival but from what I have experienced on Carnival and RCCL is that I was doted on by both lines and there was no instance where I felt services were not exceptional. On our first cruise, our cabin steward on the Inspiration, Menino was so wonderful with our kids, we gave him $20.00 cash on the side plus our prepaid sign and sail. I wish I could have offered more. I can understand that these crew members need to give fantastic service for a tip but I can also understand that these people may have been ripped off a time or two by greedy people who don't believe in giving a tip as the cruise industry has become more popular. I have often wondered if the cruiseline does this to protect their employees to some degree?
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Old March 2nd, 2004, 09:47 PM
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Default Re: The Truth about Tipping

Well I just have one question I was informed that for our 3rd n 4th person in our cabin which will be our 3yr old n 9 yr old they expect the same tipping and take out the same amount on our sail n sign card for them does anyone know if this is how that works on carnival I do agree in tipping but do not agree with having to tip an extra $140.00 for a 3 n 9 yr old in our room .PLease help
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Old March 2nd, 2004, 10:39 PM
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Default Re: The Truth about Tipping

People don't tip because they get good service, they tip because it is expected. If this weren’t true then we would tip everyone, in every capacity, whenever a good job was done. As it is, we are embarrassed not to tip.

If the cruise lines would take a "carrot and stick" approach, i.e., give bonuses and promotions to the good employees, and fire the bad ones, then tipping wouldn't be necessary. In fact, if a cruise line would enforce a strict "no-tipping" policy, even though their prices were higher, they would become the cruise line of choice--at least for me.

(BTW, for those of you working for a base salary of $2.00-$2.50 an hour—what do you think of your employer? Don’t you think he should be the one paying you what you are worth instead of his customers?)

Zoomer

Post Edited (03-02-04 22:46)
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Old March 2nd, 2004, 11:04 PM
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Default Re: Re: The Truth about Tipping

I dunno, Shelly-

Those kids are going to sleep on sheets that will be changed. They'll be entertained by either you or the Carnival staff. They'll be dirtying dishes, silverware, table linen....

I cringe at the thought of them in an adult pool, but that's another subject.

************************************************** ************************************

We sailed on the Conquest last week. Had the sign/sail tips added to our bill, plus we tipped extra to a few who knocked themselves out.
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Old March 2nd, 2004, 11:34 PM
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Default Re: The Truth about Tipping

Hi Nanette...

That's my question--why should we tip just because someone does his job--change sheets, entertain, clean dishes...? Why doesn't the employer pay a fair salary so the customer won't have to be called upon to make up the difference?

zoomer
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Old March 3rd, 2004, 12:08 AM
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Default Re: The Truth about Tipping

Here are some comments about tipping from the perspective of 40 cruises on almost every line over the last 40 years.
To the person that said raise the price and do away with tipping and that would be their line of choice. First, that already exists, there are lines just like that. Prices run from $400.per day per person up to and beyond $2000 per day per person. Been there done that. Plus, suprise, there is plenty of tipping on those ships. When do you want to cruise? At those prices, I'll become a TA

Complaining about pre or auto- tipping on your S$S card is understandable. Unless you know the history, In the middle years of our cruising experience a strange thing started happening. All tipping was done by cash in envelopes at the last nights dinner. That dinner became less and less attended. It got to the point that there would be less than half the tables occupied. I was embarassed to be there even tho I had my tip envelope ready and willing. The cruiselines had to do something about this wholesale stiffing and the result is the auto tipping on our S&S cards.
There will always be people in the service business that don't belong there. Sadly they have no clue what good service is. But the overwhelming majority of people in that industry DO know what their jobs are. And they provide good to excellent service and should be compensated accordingly. I find that the new tipping policy has improved service. The workers are happier knowing that most are too embarassed to remove the tips at the Purser's desk. Now they can work extra hard to get over tips and make even more money.
We have cruised the "upscale lines" but my 2nd cruise on Carnival's Pride we had a waiter named "Chubby" that provided the best service I have ever had.

Our tipping IS still up to us, it is not required. But some places it is required. I've heard service people here complain about German tourists being bad tippers. That's because EVERY restaurant/bar bill you pay over there has 15% added, plus you leave the odd coins from your bill. Here they often just leave the odd coins because they assume the tip has been added
.
We all need to just budget in the tips cost and not gripe about it. If you do really receive bad service (one person in 40 cruises), don't tip that person.

And tipping has always been a service fee.
Dan

Post Edited (03-03-04 00:16)
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Old March 3rd, 2004, 02:00 AM
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Default Re: The Truth about Tipping

Dan40

Why would the price for a cruise go from less than $100 a day to $400-$2000 a day just because tipping is not allowed?

Why does tipping have to be a service fee? Why not make the employer pay his fair share and require the employees do their jobs without relying on tips--instead of expecting the customer to make up the difference?

Zoomer (tipped-out)
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Old March 3rd, 2004, 07:38 AM
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Default Re: The Truth about Tipping

I just finished reading all your comments and I am amazed and diappointed of what I have just read. I am probably much younger then most of the people on this board which means I should be the immature one. But as I can see I am not. I just got off a ship a few days ago, i went with the prepaid tipping and I still got excellent service. To be exact I got better then excellent service. I was treated great by everyone. It was my pleasure to tip them all additonally. Most of these people are away from their families and loved ones for motnhs at a time. And most of them do it for financial reasons. They send almost all there money back home to help. And you are going to tell me that an aditional few bucks is going to break you. Well listen up, have one less beer a day, or one less fancy drink and you will have the extra few bucks to tip them. You are right it is there job, but we all love some recognition ones in a while. Would you like to work for 200 dollars a week and know that the rest of your salary depends on how nice and how much butt you kiss. Come on everyone our lives are too short and to complicated to fuss over a few bucks. If you do not want to tip, then make your own bed, cook your own food and server your self and that is my opinion. I have never worked as a server but I know plenty of people who have worked on ships and never got a penny from people that they served all week. How CHEAP is that!

I am sorry if this offends some people but the truth hurts...
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Old March 3rd, 2004, 08:01 AM
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Default Re: The Truth about Tipping

What a lot of people fail to grasp is that the consumer pays the wages not the employer. The cost of labor is factored into the cost of the goods or service. If cruiselines or other service related industries eliminate tipping, the consumer will pay increased fees to compensate for increased labor costs. It's just like when Congress mandates an increase in the minimum wage, business doesn't eat the cost, the cost is passed down to the consumer so we all end up paying more. I'm a bartender myself and while I get ticked when I get stiffed on a tip, rarely, if ever,do I end a shift with less than 18% of my sales in tips. For everyone who doesn't tip, there are 2 that are very generous and make it up. I thank everyone for whatever they leave as a gratuity for me and my family.
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Old March 3rd, 2004, 08:21 AM
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Default Re: Re: The Truth about Tipping

Yes Shelly,
I've always tipped the regular amounts when cruising with my kids. The staff goes out of their way to make the "kids" cruise fun. Both in the dining room and your cabin.

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Old March 3rd, 2004, 09:19 AM
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Default Re: The Truth about Tipping

Zoomer,
A reality check would be a good idea. No employer has ever paid anybody anything, and never will. WE pay for everything. The employers just divides up the money and if they give some to the employees, they keep more for themselves. If we pay the employees, we decide who gets how much.
You are tipped out? I was a corporate officer [now retired] when we held a national meeting at a hotel or resort, we paid high prices for everything and supplied the facility with detailed plans for each step of the meeting. And there were rehersals whenever possible. With all of that I would not even consider starting a meeting day without $2000. in 5's, 10's amd 20's in my pocket to grease the glitches that were sure to happen. Same thing with trade shows.
At one trade show in NY. To get a piece of equipment off the truck, across the walkway and up one level to the showroom was $800. in tips to well paid union workers. Now that was extorsion. And you are complaining about tips and I'm not????

On the upscale lines, there is a lot more than just "no tipping required". Things like drinks being included, larger cabins, better meals, superb smaller ships, etc. etc.
But while tipping is not required and there are no tipping guidelines, tipping still happens there as well.

Tipping is the grease for the service machine. So if you want to have that slickery service, you better be ready to provide the grease.
Dan
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Old March 3rd, 2004, 10:05 AM
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Default Re: The Truth about Tipping

Hey Sunshine

I am not offended by your interesting point of view.

The price I paid for (my cruise, my hotel room, 7 night stay at a resort or even a ball game for that matter) is INCLUSIVE of all those services. That's how they determine their final pricing to the public - based on all their expenses and profit marging in order to provide that product or service to the end user.

I personally do not tip where I feel it is not necessary. I have never tipped my mortage advisor, my favorite bank teller, the baker, my barber, gas attendant, my mechanic, my lawn maintenance company, my local hardware owner etc..

These are are service industry related positions who have helped my immensley more than my waiter for two hours.

I agree with some of the previous comments. I shouldn't be made to feel guilty about not tipping someone who happens to be in a specific low wage industry.
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Old March 3rd, 2004, 10:07 AM
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Default Re: Re: The Truth about Tipping

Well said Dan and I can say that Dan has truely explained the "Truth about tipping". The other truth is that some people are to cheap to part with any money unless it is actually IN the cost. Others are lazy or ignorant, (not stupid, just unaware), of the rules of tipping.
Jim

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Old March 3rd, 2004, 11:27 AM
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Default Re: The Truth about Tipping

Shelly,

I had the same concern about tipping for my 3 and 5 yrs olds but after having a amazing experience with our first cruise crew I felt that they diserve it and more. I hope you have just as good of a crew as we did and I hope they treat your children as well as they did mine. If not adjust the tip but I don't think you will want to. My children still talk about our waiters in the dinning room a couple of times a week.
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Old March 3rd, 2004, 12:16 PM
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Default Re: The Truth about Tipping

Children make more of a mess than the adults. The staff should be tipped the same as the adults. I have seen many little ones in high chairs in the dining rooms, throwing their food on the floor and all over the place. Who do you think cleans it up? Tip the staff more! What you think is cute and sweet, is a pain to the staff.
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Old March 3rd, 2004, 01:57 PM
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Default Re: The Truth about Tipping

This may help about tipping http://members.aol.com/CruiseTip

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Old March 3rd, 2004, 03:25 PM
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Default Re: The Truth about Tipping

they pay their help poorly because they can, thats why you never see ships registered in the us cause then they have to pay minimum wage

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Old March 3rd, 2004, 04:39 PM
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Default Re: The Truth about Tipping

Steve,
U.S. restaurants seldom pay minimum wage either. Some posters above have already said they get $2.00 and change per hour. The rest is tips. I know of some upscale restaurants that CHARGE the "employees" to work there because the tips are so good. One in Miami charges $250. a week for the job.


2cruiseornot2cruise,
Were you waiting for some wise guy to say, "Why not tip her, I do."


left yourself wide open.
Dan
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