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Old August 12th, 2007, 08:51 PM
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Default carnival victory - AVOID this ship!

quickly, for the benefit of anyone for whom it's not too late - do yourself a favor and avoid this ship. while my heart goes out to the worker bees crew - cabin stewards, food service, etc. carnival needs a wake up call.

my husband, mom and i joined my brother, his wife and their 3 kids for a 6 day nyc-halifax-st john - nyc cruise. we just got off the ship today. this was perhaps my husband and my 40th cruise, but only the second on carnival. i've avoided this line for years but in may decided to do a week on the liberty and found the liberty to be absolutely lovely and effiecient and well, fun. the victory is not the liberty. there is little fun on this victory 'fun ship' and the food is just shy of awful. the scheduling is downright dumb for anyone in second seating. the days are a series of disappointment after disappointment. activities are moved to other locations without notice. it's all just a mess. the exception is the youngest children's center, camp carnival. my youngest niece 4 years old loved this place and it gave her parents some terrific quality time.

this ship is in dire need of leadership, organization and morale. i'm sure the captain, engineer, etc. - those who sail the ship - are doing a fine job BUT the crew with whom you interact as a customer is a deflated bunch, and not particularly service-oriented. three separate individuals told me that they were leaving after their contract was up. working conditions are deplorable. how these people keep smiling is beyond me ... many have stopped smiling. the trip was a total waste of money, absolutely the very worst cruise i've ever taken. i can't imagine that i'd take a chance with a carnival cruise again after this experience.

you know how the crew makes small talk as you interact with them? no fewer than FOUR different staff told me - within minutes and without any questioning on my part - that they would not renew their contracts with carnival, and that the warning flags the public sees are only the tip of the iceberg. there are so many disenchanted, hard working, unappreciated workers. it's heartbreaking. and the cruise director is just plain wierd. he overtalks everything and ends every announcement with a "woo-hoo!"

i know i've been all over the place with this posting - it's still so raw (we got home only 6 hours ago). i just really hoped i could save SOMEBODY a major disappointment regarding their vacation. good luck.
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Old August 12th, 2007, 11:55 PM
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So sorry you didn't enjoy your cruise. We are scheduled to sail on the Victory October 7 out of Norfolk. It is too late to cancel - we have lots of family meeting us for the cruise. I would love to talk more to you about this to find out about the cabins, etc. Please email me at hanclan4_227@msn.com.

Thanks!!
Jenny
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Old August 13th, 2007, 12:30 AM
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Don't get too put off by one person's expereience. We were on the victory less than 2 years ago and had a great time. I will not say the originial poster is wrong, just they were unhappy with something they experienced and not everyone will feel the same way, or have the same bad experience. No details were given, just a lot of scary accusations.
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Old August 13th, 2007, 01:50 AM
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I've sailed times with Carnival ( maybe 15 or so), and am a big fan of Carnival. My next 3 cruises are actually on Carnival.

I sailed on the Victory Nov. '04, and oddly the posters comments are very close to my own experiences on this ship almost 3 years ago.

It's the only Carnival ship I've sailed that I wouldn't repeat. Though after all this time I'd have expected it to change and get in line with the experience of other Carnival ships.
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Old August 13th, 2007, 07:57 AM
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Wow, I'm surprised by this recent "downgrade" as illustrated by these comments about the Victory. I've sailed on her four times and she is still one of my favorites. I've never experienced what is being written here. I've been on 20 Carnival cruises, Carnival continues to be my cruise line of choice and I can't say that I've ever had a "horrible" experience as outlined here. Yes, sometimes things don't go exactly as planned, but you have to focus on the positive.
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Old August 13th, 2007, 08:03 AM
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I love these kind of posts.
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Old August 13th, 2007, 08:45 AM
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Default just one example - carnival victory

listen, i'm so sorry ... i really didn't want to scare anybody. i've cruised often - at least 40 cruises, often 3-4x a year, so, at least for me, this experience is valid and i'd like to spare others who browse before they buy. i just think forewarned is forearamed. i simply found that the purser's desk is largely a smiling, polite, unhelpful group of (seemingly) motor vehicle rejects. i could list several very specific examples, but i want to give just one. one of our situations involved my mom, orthepedically handicapped, who was sharing a cabin with my husband and me. i had spoken to the cruise line and done all my homework ahead of time. we were supposed to have two singles and an upper - a single for my mom, the upper for my husband , and a single for me so i could help her and so she could have some privacy (my husband's bunk was over hers, he would only have been able to see me sleeping, etc. )

once on board - when of course the "SHIP IS FULL, NO CABINS AVAILABLE) sign is posted before you even board, we learned we had been give a different cabin with no upper bunk and had to deal with a roll-away bed. with now 3 FLOOR beds (one inferior, the other two heavenly) and a SOFA that could not be removed from the room, we had a line-up of four large pieces of furniture in a row, a skinny aisle from the door to the balcony, and a wheelchair that had to be moved in and out of the room any time someone had to go t the bathroom get into the closet, etc.

and because the skinny aisle was too narrow to accomodate the wheelchair, my mom had to struggle out of the wheelchair at the door and be supported into the room to get to her bed, etc. this was difficult but more than that it was humiliating ... she and my husband handled it with grace but there was no privacy and many frustrating moments. life is tough enough when you love someone who is handicapped. we don't need to pay for indignities. this was more than an inconvenience that lasted all day, every day and it mattered.

what's not significant is the handicap issue ... what IS significant is that anyone on board can find themselves faced with an 'equivalent' cabin change even if your cabin has been assigned prior to sailing with the set-up that your family needs and pays for. in our case the change was not an upgrade, just an unwanted and could-not-be-corrected change that i had PLANNED for ahead of time and was wantonly disregarded. and once that ship is full, no matter how legitimate your situation is, there really is no recourse.

i hope this has been a fair example. as an experienced cruiser, i know we have to be flexible, and we don't disappoint easily, and we always try to just enjoy whatever experience we're having. but this ship is bad and its crew is sad. if you love carnival book another vessel. blessings, rosemary
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Old August 13th, 2007, 10:25 AM
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Default Re: just one example - carnival victory

Quote:
Originally Posted by rosemarywh
listen, i'm so sorry ... i really didn't want to scare anybody. i've cruised often - at least 40 cruises, often 3-4x a year, so, at least for me, this experience is valid and i'd like to spare others who browse before they buy. i just think forewarned is forearamed. i simply found that the purser's desk is largely a smiling, polite, unhelpful group of (seemingly) motor vehicle rejects. i could list several very specific examples, but i want to give just one. one of our situations involved my mom, orthepedically handicapped, who was sharing a cabin with my husband and me. i had spoken to the cruise line and done all my homework ahead of time. we were supposed to have two singles and an upper - a single for my mom, the upper for my husband , and a single for me so i could help her and so she could have some privacy (my husband's bunk was over hers, he would only have been able to see me sleeping, etc. )

once on board - when of course the "SHIP IS FULL, NO CABINS AVAILABLE) sign is posted before you even board, we learned we had been give a different cabin with no upper bunk and had to deal with a roll-away bed. with now 3 FLOOR beds (one inferior, the other two heavenly) and a SOFA that could not be removed from the room, we had a line-up of four large pieces of furniture in a row, a skinny aisle from the door to the balcony, and a wheelchair that had to be moved in and out of the room any time someone had to go t the bathroom get into the closet, etc.

and because the skinny aisle was too narrow to accomodate the wheelchair, my mom had to struggle out of the wheelchair at the door and be supported into the room to get to her bed, etc. this was difficult but more than that it was humiliating ... she and my husband handled it with grace but there was no privacy and many frustrating moments. life is tough enough when you love someone who is handicapped. we don't need to pay for indignities. this was more than an inconvenience that lasted all day, every day and it mattered.

what's not significant is the handicap issue ... what IS significant is that anyone on board can find themselves faced with an 'equivalent' cabin change even if your cabin has been assigned prior to sailing with the set-up that your family needs and pays for. in our case the change was not an upgrade, just an unwanted and could-not-be-corrected change that i had PLANNED for ahead of time and was wantonly disregarded. and once that ship is full, no matter how legitimate your situation is, there really is no recourse.

i hope this has been a fair example. as an experienced cruiser, i know we have to be flexible, and we don't disappoint easily, and we always try to just enjoy whatever experience we're having. but this ship is bad and its crew is sad. if you love carnival book another vessel. blessings, rosemary
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Old August 13th, 2007, 10:32 AM
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Default Re: just one example - carnival victory

Quote:
Originally Posted by rosemarywh
listen, i'm so sorry ... i really didn't want to scare anybody. i've cruised often - at least 40 cruises, often 3-4x a year, so, at least for me, this experience is valid and i'd like to spare others who browse before they buy. i just think forewarned is forearamed. i simply found that the purser's desk is largely a smiling, polite, unhelpful group of (seemingly) motor vehicle rejects. i could list several very specific examples, but i want to give just one. one of our situations involved my mom, orthepedically handicapped, who was sharing a cabin with my husband and me. i had spoken to the cruise line and done all my homework ahead of time. we were supposed to have two singles and an upper - a single for my mom, the upper for my husband , and a single for me so i could help her and so she could have some privacy (my husband's bunk was over hers, he would only have been able to see me sleeping, etc. )

once on board - when of course the "SHIP IS FULL, NO CABINS AVAILABLE) sign is posted before you even board, we learned we had been give a different cabin with no upper bunk and had to deal with a roll-away bed. with now 3 FLOOR beds (one inferior, the other two heavenly) and a SOFA that could not be removed from the room, we had a line-up of four large pieces of furniture in a row, a skinny aisle from the door to the balcony, and a wheelchair that had to be moved in and out of the room any time someone had to go t the bathroom get into the closet, etc.

and because the skinny aisle was too narrow to accomodate the wheelchair, my mom had to struggle out of the wheelchair at the door and be supported into the room to get to her bed, etc. this was difficult but more than that it was humiliating ... she and my husband handled it with grace but there was no privacy and many frustrating moments. life is tough enough when you love someone who is handicapped. we don't need to pay for indignities. this was more than an inconvenience that lasted all day, every day and it mattered.

what's not significant is the handicap issue ... what IS significant is that anyone on board can find themselves faced with an 'equivalent' cabin change even if your cabin has been assigned prior to sailing with the set-up that your family needs and pays for. in our case the change was not an upgrade, just an unwanted and could-not-be-corrected change that i had PLANNED for ahead of time and was wantonly disregarded. and once that ship is full, no matter how legitimate your situation is, there really is no recourse.

i hope this has been a fair example. as an experienced cruiser, i know we have to be flexible, and we don't disappoint easily, and we always try to just enjoy whatever experience we're having. but this ship is bad and its crew is sad. if you love carnival book another vessel. blessings, rosemary
Perhaps the decision to put 3 people and a wheelchair in a regular-sized cabin may have contributed to your disappointing experience. Also, the sofas are designed to be slept on. If one of you had slept on the sofa, san the extra bed would there have been room for the wheelchair?

However, I do understand that sometimes, that first disappointment colors the entire experience for you.

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Old August 13th, 2007, 11:18 AM
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Default for ibcruzin ... clarification

the sofa was a actually a two-seater loveseat; it did not fold out, and a child could have slept in it, but not an adult. the cabin we bought and paid for but did not receive would have met our needs nicely ... we've done this dozens of times before.

i don't know that we have a cruiseline of choice ... we've enjoyed most major cruise lines regardless of their tier (budget, middle market, high end etc.) ... i think it sometimes boils down to the ship, and this ship blew it. these boards have helped me a great deal in the past - including some of your own postings - and i'm paying it forward. caveat emptor.
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Old August 13th, 2007, 11:30 AM
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Default Re: for ibcruzin ... clarification

Quote:
Originally Posted by rosemarywh
the sofa was a actually a two-seater loveseat; it did not fold out, and a child could have slept in it, but not an adult. the cabin we bought and paid for but did not receive would have met our needs nicely ... we've done this dozens of times before.

i don't know that we have a cruiseline of choice ... we've enjoyed most major cruise lines regardless of their tier (budget, middle market, high end etc.) ... i think it sometimes boils down to the ship, and this ship blew it. these boards have helped me a great deal in the past - including some of your own postings - and i'm paying it forward. caveat emptor.
Oh, o.k. Did you attempt to change your cabin or did you just see the sign and let it go? For future reference, that sign is stuck up at the Purser's Desk on every cruise regardless of whether the ship is full (most ships are full). However, "full" is not really "full". Carnival (and I imagine other cruiselines) always holds out a few cabins in case they have to move a passenger for whatever reason. The sign they put up is to deter people from deciding after they get on the ship that they now want a window or balcony or they don't want to be on Deck "X" but want to be up on Deck "Y" with their new friends. It holds the drama down.

I have only heard good things about the Victory. I guess it needs an overhaul of management and staff. Maybe your cruise was at the end of most of the crew's contracts and everyone on board was a bit burnt out.

As far as the working conditions are concerned, I think this is just the reason why the cruiselines do not tend to hire American workers for most of their ship-side positions. American workers have a different standard of acceptability when it comes to salary, working hours, benefits and working conditions. When Carnival holds job fairs in emerging markets, they can get the pick of the litter and not have to deal with disgruntled employees.
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Old August 13th, 2007, 12:02 PM
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Default what's going on here?

come on, ibcruzin ... do i seem like somebody who'd walk away from the purser's desk just because i saw a sign? of course i asked. i can see you're a carnival fan. isn't somebody not allowed to be? are no one else's experiences legitimate? relax ... it's just an opinion, just a posting. i don't expect it will result in your fleet being banished from the seas. now go find somebody else to bully. jeeez ...
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Old August 13th, 2007, 12:10 PM
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Default Re: what's going on here?

Quote:
Originally Posted by rosemarywh
come on, ibcruzin ... do i seem like somebody who'd walk away from the purser's desk just because i saw a sign? of course i asked. i can see you're a carnival fan. isn't somebody not allowed to be? are no one else's experiences legitimate? relax ... it's just an opinion, just a posting. i don't expect it will result in your fleet being banished from the seas. now go find somebody else to bully. jeeez ...
?????? Where did that come from?

I was just trying to be helpful. I think if you go to that other board you will find someone to fight with.

I am not defending the cruiseship. I am just offering some explanation as to why you had such a negative experience.

Sorry. Will not post to your thread again.
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Old August 13th, 2007, 12:16 PM
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Hi Rosemary,

I am so sorry you had such a bad cruise. I have a few questions if you don't mind.

Have you contacted Carnival since you arrived home?

Did you pick your room, or was it a guarantee thing?

Could you give us a few things that you did like about the cruise?
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Old August 13th, 2007, 12:19 PM
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Default my mistake

i misread you. I'M sorry. please post to my thread anytime. mea culpa.
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Old August 13th, 2007, 12:20 PM
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I think you might be whipping a dead horse here, Luanne.......
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Old August 13th, 2007, 01:37 PM
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Hi Maryann....I can totally relate to your story. In May my girl-friend and I decided to take a last minute cruise....only a four day cruise...alone without our husbands. Anyways to get to the story we booked a cruise on the 2nd oldest ship with Carnival, which is Carnival Celebration. In our documents we received before our cruise we were assigned our cabin room and floor. Well when we boarded this horrible ship...a ship I would NEVER sail again even if it was a totally "free" cruise. Although the new room assigned was on the same floor...which was the main deck where you boarded the ship. We went from having a room in the front of the ship to the very last room in the back of the ship. This room we were stuck with was right above the engine...so not only was it loud when we sailed... the whole room shook....so loud me and my friend couldn't even hear one-another talk unless we screamed. This room wasn't fit for the stewards cleaning supplies...unless passengers. We went to the pursers desk and they gave us nothing but the run-around the whole cruise. "They claimed they would look into the mistake and let us know if we could move to another cabin". To make a very long story short....we went back numerous times that first day and they said "they were still looking into, we should check back the following day". We were at the pursers desk the following day when we woke up and they "claimed the ship was totally booked" if that was the case why didn't they share this info with us the day we boarded? Than we asked them to move the people who was in our original cabin to the cabin of "hell" that we had since we should of never been switched in the first place. "They stated they couldn't impose on the couple who was in our actual cabin, since we were already in the 2nd day of a 4 day cruise". Not only did we talk to the main purser at the desk and explained hoe carinval's reputation hasn't lived up to their standards...my friend who has never cruised with carnival told him this was the first and very last time she would ever cruise with their cruise-line. The next morning..the 3rd day of the cruise....we received this nicely typed letter for the main purser expressing his apologozies...he also included 6-free drink vouchers, 3-vouchers for the both of us. Although it was a nice gesture it didn't make us for the "hell" we went through while we were in the cabin and all the noise we endured while trying to sleep. The seas were very rough and with all the loudness and shifting in the cabin I had motion-sickness for most of the cruise. I thank God the ladies we had dinner with had an extra motion-sickness patch that she was kind enough to give me....but I lost a whole entrie day while in port at Freeport...I had a all day excursion booked to swim with the dolphins....and the excursion for 2-people totaled 180.00..."Mr. Purser" was so kind to give me a full refund for the excursion because he knew they were wrong in how they treated us. I can tell you this...my firend and I weren't the only ones complaining about our cabins. One other couple was there who were on their honeymoon....not only didn't the husband receive his luggage...but they gave them the wrong room...a interior room with two single beds when they were suppose to have a balcony-suite...."huge mistake". I truly think Carnival should get their act together...because their customer service "SUCKS"!!!! I guess that's why I love RC the best....they have much better class than Carnival....but again this is only my opinion.

Jessie
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Old August 13th, 2007, 01:47 PM
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One less person or persons on my favorite cruise line!
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Old August 13th, 2007, 01:52 PM
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Thats so sad and I am really sorry that a couple of you had a bad experience with CCL. Although I think what is being lost here is that it is not a cruise line problem but a specific ship problem.

It would be the same as if you went to a certain hotel chain in one city and found it infested with cockroaches. You would not assume that ALL of the hotels in that chain have cockroaches.

We went on the CCL Inspiration (a older ship also) and had an AMAZING time. I thought it was just me because it was my first cruise. But my BF's family sailed the same ship and itinerary a couple weeks later and were just as in love as I was. They on the other hand are experienced cruisers. Hope that lends some light to a different angle in this debate. Carla
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Old August 13th, 2007, 01:59 PM
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This is the reason we pick our own rooms. I have done my research, and know what I am getting into.

It is also why it is risky getting a booking so close to sail date. They want to fill up the cabins, all of them.

Also, when you book a guarantee room. It is never your room, until you board the ship. They do lots of switching around. You do pay a lower price, but you take your chances.

Jessie, I just read your review you wrote after you came back. You say you had a good time, and you talk about all the wonderful people. Maybe you could add that here as well, so that people don't start jumping ship, so to speak.
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Old August 13th, 2007, 04:08 PM
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Rosemary, I'm sorry you had such a terrible experience on the Victory, I have sailed on this ship 3 times with absolutely no complaints. If Carnival management has someone reading these posts, hopefully, they will take your complaints seriously and address them a.s.a.p.

After reading all the comments, this thread makes a darn good argument for pre-planning, soliciting feedback from seasoned cruisers and a good T.A. Some PVP's employed by the cruise lines are very helpful and knowledgeable but some are not. When I posed a recent question to a Carnival PVP as to the layout of furniture in my stateroom and view out the window, bathroom layout, they did not have a clue (it was a special needs room for my mother-in-law)...the correct information was obtained quickly from my T.A. Prior to booking my first cruise many years ago, I read every article I could lay my hands on regarding cruise lines, cruise destinations, cruise reviews, stateroom locations, cruise line policies and procedures, etc. Before I pick up the phone to make that initial booking call, I know exactly which itinerary I want to sail, location of the stateroom I want to book, shore excursions, back-up plans, ship layout, dining venues, etc. Lots of people book a stateroom guarantee because you can save a little money but I never want to be in the position that Jessie was in. Knowledge is power, the more you know and plan, the less opportunity for mistakes resulting in disappointment and stress.
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Old August 13th, 2007, 05:43 PM
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Hi Luanne...Yes I did write a post-cruise report...although we endured a few problems with this particular ship....we made the best of our trip. The dining room waiters we had on Carnival Celebration was great.....had many laughs with them....and the food was great all week long. I guess I expected a lot more of the ship....never been on an older ship....and wouldn't mind going on another smaller CCL ship but I only hope if I choose an older ship in the future it's much cleaner than what we experienced on the Celebration. In 2001 when me and my DH got married we took Carinval Destiny....and back than it was a new shiper and we had a great time. I know every ship is going to differ from service know matter what cruise-line we sail....but I didn't expect the problems we had when we sailed in May. I also want to clarify something.....when I booked this cruise in May on the Carnival Celebration....I booked a particular room....it wasn't any gurantee room...so they had NO right to move us....and we even had our documents to prove we where right....but it did nothing for us. Every cruise that I've booked I've researched...although I didn't have much time for the one in May...but I did book a particular room like I do on every cruise....I don't take chances with a "guarantee room". I think this particular ship is good for first-time cruisers because it's disappointing to go from a new ship to a very old and "dirty" ship like this one was. Sorry but we are all entitled to our own opinions. Thanks for listening!

Jessie
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Old August 13th, 2007, 05:48 PM
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Jessie,

I could not agree more about opinions, and we can learn from those opinions.

I would be very upset if I had picked a room, and not had that room. You paid extra, to pick.

What kind of correspondence have you had with Carnival?
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Old August 13th, 2007, 05:57 PM
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Luanne....I wrote them after the cruise and I actually contacted represenative who booked it for me. Prior to this cruise she would email me all the time and share different things we could do in ports if we didn't want to take the cruise-line excursions....it was like we were friends through email. She called me a few days before we were set to sail wishing us a wonderful time. I was actually hoping to use her in the future if we ever took a carnival cruise again...but after returning from the cruise I tried contacted her via-email and telephone but she never responded. All I asked for was an explanation...but I've yet received any response and that is what angers me....and proves to me what poor customer service they have both on the ship and through their carnival 800-number. I think they are very unprofessional....if it was for people like us who love to cruise at least once a year they wouldn't have a job!

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Old August 13th, 2007, 06:04 PM
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Maybe a good reason not to book with Carnival?
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Old August 13th, 2007, 07:05 PM
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I concur with your review of the Victory.. I wrote a review at another site and it was removed. I am sure this is not indicative of the entire Carnival Line but Victory is a mess.. I also spoke with some bartenders who blame the upper echelon of the Victory and that they were requesting transfers to another ship

I know hardcore Carnival fans do not like to hear this.. but its true
I have sailed about 7 cruises and went on this trip thoroughly excited and upbeat about it.. it was a complete let down.. The CD Malcolm was never seen -only heard on annoying annoucements he made..

I know i will probably get flamed for this but this particular ship is a complete failure and apparently CCL received alot of complaints.. They made me a very generous offer to sail again and I will try them again

I very much look forward to the next cruise and I hope the hardcore fans of CCL are right!.. Sometimes it just happens...
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Old August 13th, 2007, 07:18 PM
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Toni,

Welcome to Cruisemates!!! You will not be flamed here. We don't do that. What we do is learn from the reviews, and compare them to other reviews, and make up our own mind.

Again, welcome!!!

Luanne
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Old August 13th, 2007, 07:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Luanne Russo
Toni,

Welcome to Cruisemates!!! You will not be flamed here. We don't do that. What we do is learn from the reviews, and compare them to other reviews, and make up our own mind.

Again, welcome!!!

Luanne
Thank you and that is refreshing!!
I look forward to discussing the love of cruising with you all
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Old August 13th, 2007, 07:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Toni1313
I concur with your review of the Victory.. I wrote a review at another site and it was removed.

I know hardcore Carnival fans do not like to hear this..

I know i will probably get flamed for this but this particular ship is a complete failure and apparently CCL received alot of complaints..

I very much look forward to the next cruise and I hope the hardcore fans of CCL are right!.. Sometimes it just happens...
You don't get flamed here at Cruisemates. I am a hardcord fan but did not care for my experience on the Destiny so I understand that all Carnival ships are not created equal. However, in order to put the best face on any situation, I am quite pragmatic and look for a cause for a negative event. Sometimes the cause is just so deeply rooted that there is no fix.

I guess Carnival needs to take heed. I know they do read these forum boards so they know what the masses are saying.
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Old August 13th, 2007, 07:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IBCRUZIN'
Quote:
Originally Posted by Toni1313
I concur with your review of the Victory.. I wrote a review at another site and it was removed.

I know hardcore Carnival fans do not like to hear this..

I know i will probably get flamed for this but this particular ship is a complete failure and apparently CCL received alot of complaints..

I very much look forward to the next cruise and I hope the hardcore fans of CCL are right!.. Sometimes it just happens...
You don't get flamed here at Cruisemates. I am a hardcord fan but did not care for my experience on the Destiny so I understand that all Carnival ships are not created equal. However, in order to put the best face on any situation, I am quite pragmatic and look for a cause for a negative event. Sometimes the cause is just so deeply rooted that there is no fix.

I guess Carnival needs to take heed. I know they do read these forum boards so they know what the masses are saying.

Thanks! Wow i am so impressed already over here
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