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  #31 (permalink)  
Old February 12th, 2010, 12:04 PM
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Just for accuracy...

The usual ship classifications are as follows:

Mainstream (known as "Contemporary" in the field): Carnival. Royal Caribbean, NCL. Costa , MSC

Premium: Holland America, Celebrity, Disney and usually Princess. I put Princess in this category because I truly believe they qualify in terms of food & service. Some travel agents disagree for the following reasons: many of their ships are getting pretty old, and some of the newer ones are as big as Carnival, but they do things like put five dining rooms on the ship so it feels more like an intimate ship. I actually prefer bigger ships because they have more options and activities - as long as they don't get crowded. I think Princess does a good job of crowd flow - as it is called. I have enjoyed every Princess cruise I have been on a great deal - some of my favorite cruises ever.

I have not taken an extended cruise on Celebrity except for a 1-week cruise in the caribbean on Solstice. It is a beautiful ship - bigger than Princess but holding fewer passengers.

I have been on short cruises on Millie and Summit. I do not find them that exciting, to be honest, too small for me for a Caribbean cruise. I do like small ships for port-intensive itineraries like Europe or Alaska, however, but if a ship has pod problems I would not book it for a destination-oriented cruise.

Deluxe: Oceania, Azamara and the small Princess ships have their own catregory: deluxe. Windstar is in this category usually as well. They are not quite luxury, but because of the open seating dining with alternative restaurants for a small passenger load they are considered close to luxury.

Luxury: Silversea, Seabourn, Regent and Crystal.
  #32 (permalink)  
Old February 12th, 2010, 12:39 PM
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I would refer those who are interested in the recurring propulsion problems, which are IMHO, very relevant, to a thread giving the real story. Rather than go into the lengthy history of the more than twenty times this same problem has cropped up on M-class ships; the thread is near the bottom of page 11 and can be found by doing a search on "discussion of propulsion failures".

This problem is only minor if you are one of the lucky passengers on the Millennium, Infinity or Summit who has not yet encountered this problem.

After reading the comment about a "minor problem", a dear friend of mine reminded me about the cruise she was on in Alaska on the Infinity when this ship was having one of these propulsion failures and the ship arrived five or six hours late. After waiting all that time on the pier, by the time boarding was completed customs had closed. So instead of sailing the ship sat in port over night and then the next morning all passengers were forced to disembark and go through the whole boarding process all over again. Net result was almost two days were lost from a 1 week cruise.
Now I doubt if this would be called a "minor" problem for those onboard!!!!

For me, I would not call a car that worked, most of the time, or an airplane that had no engine problems, most of the time, premium and I feel the same way about ships.

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  #33 (permalink)  
Old February 12th, 2010, 01:52 PM
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At this point I think I have to point this out - I realize some of you don't want to hear ND's story, but I suggest you just skip over them. We don't practice censorship here at CM just because someone says something negative about a cruise line.

I also know that many people save a long time and select a cruise largely based on the itinerary. Many of those people read CruiseMates even if they do not post. In fact, for every post we have about 200 readers, on average, who never post. We have about 250,000 visitors/month to these boards. You can NOT go by what you see in the message boards and think that reflects our average visitor. The people who post here are generally far more experienced than the average reader.

Therefore, while it is fine for you to express your opinion that for you a pod problem is "minor" I feel that is a statement that only a devoted cruiser (loves sea days, for example) who does not care about the scheduled destinations would make. I am very experienced, yet I do care about destinations a great deal, especially if I have not seen them before, and were I to miss even one of them I would feel cheated. There are some ports I do not care about, but only because I have seen them many times.

The only time I do not care to see a port is if a ship is diverted for a hurricane. Why would I want to go to an island experiencing 120 mph winds?

The vast majority of our readers are NOT in the experienced category. They have only been on a few cruises and their itineraries are selected very carefully. As a professional cruise advisor (as a reporter) I feel fully responsible to tell people about potential problems that could affect their ability to see their desired ports.

That is why I have warned people over the years about health questionaire forms, hurricane season, norovirus and all other maladies that can affect your cruise and for which you may not have a recourse.

I asked about these ships - and I did not have an agenda. I merely asked for opinions because I knew they were getting dated. My original post was made before the refurbishments for these ships were announced.

I do think they are attractive ships. My concern was just their age. I was also curious about the state of the cuisine, entertainment, service, stateroom design (as ships age their staterooms get outdated and there isn't much you can do about it).

All opinions are welcome, and all opinions are equal. I am happy to hear from everyone but I also ask that you not judge one another. If someone says they think pod problems are minor I respect that opinion, and I also respect the opposite opinion.

Lets all please just remember that there is no right or wrong in your taste for cruising - there is only what is important to you. It's like the question "Is Oasis too big?" I don't think so, but a lot of people do. There is no right or wrong, it is a matter of taste. I think Oasis is a great ship, but if someone told me it was their first cruise and that exotic quiet destinations were important to them, I would recommend a smaller ship. That is only logical, as Oasis is a destination unto itself and its ports of call are fairly crowded.


There are many other aspects to these ships, lets all drop the pod thing in this thread, or else I will just lock the thread up. Thank you~!

And once again - those of you who are tired of hearing about the pods - do you think you are making things any better by making that comment over and over again? I brought this up once already. If she makes the comment and you ignore it gets far less mileage than when you make a state case out of it.
  #34 (permalink)  
Old February 12th, 2010, 04:47 PM
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Perhaps maybe you should listen to the "other" voices out there, as well. All should have a say, and if others are tired of "hearing it", perhaps you and the other moderators should take note.

Continue losing your readership is the alternative.
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Old February 12th, 2010, 05:54 PM
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Here are the facts as of right now. I called Celebrity Cruises at 2;00 their time to comment on the pods. I heard they were in the office. They did not call me back.

I dug up an article as recent as December 11, 2009 that distinctly says the pods are still as big a problem as they ever were.
Bearing Failure Sidelines Cruise Ship Again: GoArticles.com

I have seen nothing from RCI that says they plan to fix the pods even though they have settled the case. I have found nothing to say ND is not correct about this issue.

No one here has shown me anything to say she is wrong. If she is correct then for as long as new people come to Cruisemates to ask about these ships she has every right to make her comments. You are not required to read them.

I am really saddened and disappointed that anyone here would not respect the fact that this pod situation is true by all appearances to date and that you are offended by that. Rolls Royce just agreed to pay RCL for these bad pods, and by all my research I see nothing to say they have ever been fixed.

In all good consciousness I suppose I would rather lose readers than have nothing but cheerleaders who don't want to hear anything negative about a cruise line. I thought you were the kind of people who wanted to share the whole truth and the best information possible.

Isn't this exactly what the whole "Royal Champions" flap was about? Do you really prefer to have biased, inaccurate advice given out and the truth censored?

At least I can say that if you come to me for cruise information I will give you the truth to the best of my knowledge. I would think that is what you want from a cruise web site.

Heaven forbid when you are planning your next cruise someone doesn't withhold vital information from you just because they are tired of talking about it. I also hope your doctor and and your financial advisers are more professional than you expect me to be in running a cruise information web site.

If happy talk is all you want no problem - I can ban everyone who ever said anything negative about any cruise line. Or do you prefer Celebrity to be the only line for which I have a double standard?
  #36 (permalink)  
Old February 13th, 2010, 08:21 AM
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Thanks for the link to the article, Paul. That article may have been posted in December or '09 but it refers to Infinity being drydocked unexpectedly& a Hawaii cruise canceled.
"An embarrassingly long string of bearing failures got longer this week as Celebrity Cruises (a division of Royal Caribbean Cruises Ltd.) was forced to cancel yet another important cruise due to a ship's propulsion system bearing failure.
The company's Millennium-class ship, Infinity, is heading to emergency dry dock as its scheduled Hawaii cruise is cancelled."

Inifinity did not sail to Hawaii in the fall of 2009. The article may have been posted in Dec. '09, but I suspect it was written some time ago.
According to Celebrity's site, Infinity had a Hawaii cruise cancelled for propulsion problems in 2005. Press Room Details Curious. All date references in the article are 2003, 2004, & 2005

Who wrote that article anyway? Who is NBK? Something is fishy here!

Last edited by richsea; February 13th, 2010 at 08:28 AM.
  #37 (permalink)  
Old February 13th, 2010, 10:48 AM
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As a one new to cruising (We just returned from a 14 day around the horn,on Infinity) I first posted last summer asking about cruising and what was best to see in ports. I had just signed up for this cruise,and paid a lot of money for air fare to South America and back. I wish I had checked this and other cruise pages before. We had no problems with the pods but we were lucky.We took this cruise to see things and found we did not care for days just cruising.We are veteran travelers and would have been more than disappointed if there had been problems.You ask about the ship, it is very much in need of a redo,the service was wonderful, the food was average to fair(too often cold)and the excursions wonderful to bad depending on the guide. I have not posted since my first posts due to the constant bickering here. You want new posters , address that. I was interested in true information , instead I got a major fight about Celebrity versus Princess--which had nothing to do with my question.You are right Paul most new people come here for information. I have enjoyed Chit Chat for cruisers as the group with Rollerdonna seem to have no agenda.
  #38 (permalink)  
Old February 13th, 2010, 04:46 PM
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Talking Another Cruise

Quote:
Originally Posted by Manuel View Post
Parrot Mom, you and Parrot Pop are my kind of people.We all need to learn how to enjoy the positive side of life.
I also advise cruisers to have a good TA, then if there is a problem he or she can handle for you.

TM
Well, my accountant just got frightened.. Celebrity is having a sale military, seniors and I don't know what else on a few ships...and I called them directly and instead of waiting until next Saturday... just booked the Soltice AQUA class at bargain prices.. Life is good.. that means that we will go from Select to Elite on our October cruise.. Life is good!!!
  #39 (permalink)  
Old February 13th, 2010, 07:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul Motter View Post
I have seen nothing from RCI that says they plan to fix the pods even though they have settled the case. I have found nothing to say ND is not correct about this issue.

No one here has shown me anything to say she is wrong. If she is correct then for as long as new people come to Cruisemates to ask about these ships she has every right to make her comments. You are not required to read them.
I agree with Paul (this time :-D), while I find ND's comments repetitive, I'm on CM's every day so I see them every day. If I were just searching "Celebrity cruises", I'd probably be very happy to be informed about the pod problems.

P.S. to Parrott Mom: yea! for a newly booked cruise !
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  #40 (permalink)  
Old February 13th, 2010, 09:39 PM
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Parrot Mm, I am impressed that you did Cinque Terre on foot. We did it by boat.

TM
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CRUISES
Century 4/1998
Mercury 4/2000+4/2006+7/2007
Sensation 4/2002
Infinity 4/2003
Summit 4/2004+4/2005
Carnival Liberty New Year's Eve 2007
Liberty of the Seas 5/2008+11/2009
Solstice 4/2009
Oasis 4/2010+4/13/2013
Allure 1/16/ 2011
Equinox 4/11/2011
Independence 12/29/13
Vision OTS 2-14-2015


Booked Allure of the Seas... 2 / 21 / 16 *Last Gang Cruise*
Booked Celebrity Equinox ... 4 / 4 / 16 *Anniversary cruise *
  #41 (permalink)  
Old February 13th, 2010, 11:01 PM
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Cool Boat

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Parrot Mm, I am impressed that you did Cinque Terre on foot. We did it by boat.

TM
What do you mean "by boat"!!! It wasn't exactly tourist season and they had said something about a boat, but we walked and walked and walked ...at one point on "lovers lane" I thought we'd have to leave Parrot Pop with his rollator and another younger man with cane.,Two trains inbetween..ROTF Oh my heavens...you went by boat...but in other weather, earlier in the season..I would try it again...it was gorgeous and something Parrot Pop can complain about being shlepped through for year. Yes, Fern..this Celebrity ship and the AQUA class is the least expensive trip ever...now the air fare is going to be another story
  #42 (permalink)  
Old February 14th, 2010, 01:27 PM
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We were staying in Italy, so we had plenty of time.
There is boat service that goes to all the five towns. You can get off and on, but this is an all day event.

TM
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CRUISES
Century 4/1998
Mercury 4/2000+4/2006+7/2007
Sensation 4/2002
Infinity 4/2003
Summit 4/2004+4/2005
Carnival Liberty New Year's Eve 2007
Liberty of the Seas 5/2008+11/2009
Solstice 4/2009
Oasis 4/2010+4/13/2013
Allure 1/16/ 2011
Equinox 4/11/2011
Independence 12/29/13
Vision OTS 2-14-2015


Booked Allure of the Seas... 2 / 21 / 16 *Last Gang Cruise*
Booked Celebrity Equinox ... 4 / 4 / 16 *Anniversary cruise *
  #43 (permalink)  
Old February 15th, 2010, 08:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Manuel View Post
We were staying in Italy, so we had plenty of time.
There is boat service that goes to all the five towns. You can get off and on, but this is an all day event.

TM
Now, that is delightful..My optomtrist said he stayed with his family in one of the villages years ago with his family and climbed those hills.
  #44 (permalink)  
Old February 25th, 2010, 06:00 PM
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Nurse Debra,

Quote:
Originally Posted by You View Post
Congratulations on being one of the winners on one of the propulsion failure cruises on one of the Celebrity Millennium class ships. Celebrity instituted this policy because they were aware that these Mclass ships were going to fail from time to time into the future. I am afraid that your experience and that of myself and so many others with Celebrity was totally different.


IIRC, Celebrity instituted this policy when the very first propulsion failure occurred, when it was thought to be nothing more than a defective bearing installed during construction. At that point, there was no way that any of the company's executives could have foreseen any of the subsequent incidents.

Quote:
Originally Posted by You
The story that you and a few others don't seem to like to mention is the fact that there have been far more passengers impacted with missed ports, itinerary changes, shortened port times, late departures and late arrivals, than those who "won" a free cruise on Celebrity, because of emergency dry dock to make repairs. I would much rather confine my gambling to the ship casino, rather than taking a chance on whether my ship will get to all of the scheduled ports or even sail at all.


Your continued denial does not change the reality that Celebrity is that Celebrity, from the beginning, represented your vacation package as a cruise rather than as a tour by cruise ship. The contract of passage to which you agreed when you purchased this vacation stated explicitly that the ship could modify the itinerary at any time, for any reason, with no further compensation due to any passengers. Further, Celebrity not only fulfilled that contractual obligation completely by providing a cruise of the promised duration on the promised dates, but, solely as a gesture of good will, offered you a very generous credit as compenation for your disappointment.

If your travel agent failed to explain to you that the ship could deviate from the published itinerary or otherwise misrepresented what you are buying, you may have recourse against the travel agent or the travel agency.

Quote:
Originally Posted by You
Glad to hear that you were one of the winners, but keep in mind the perspective of the many thousands including myself, who on my Celebrity cruise missed more than half of a thirteen night Alaskan cruise because of this problem that has been going on for so many years.


How long are you going to continue to harbor bitterness over something that happened long ago and that you have no power whatsoever to change?

In case you have not yet figured it out, both Kuki and Paul have tried to tell you in ways that are not so subtle that it's long past time to let go, as have more than a few of the other regular posters. Just now, when I logged back in, I found a private message from another poster who sounded sufficiently exasperated to strangle you. Yet you carry on.

And whether you realize the fact or not, your posts on this subject are saying a lot more about you than about Celebrity.

Quote:
Originally Posted by You
On our POD cruise we were "generously" compensated $100 for this inconvenience.


That's $100 more than the company legally owed to you.

Norm.
  #45 (permalink)  
Old February 25th, 2010, 07:27 PM
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Somebody once asked me if I had missed a port...yes, I had..I said.. we were supposed to go to Morocco and instead ended up in Cartegena, Spain(boring port)...BUT I HAD FORGOTTEN, the cruise that wasn't... We were due to sail from NYC on the NCL Seaward to Bermuda, I remember it was September..as we got to the NCL port...we were given a slip of paper.. It seemed Bermuda was about to be hit by a hurricane and we WOULD NOT be going there but to what we called Bermuda North...Newport, Boston (our home port), Halifax, St. John and Portland or Bar Harbor...not Bermuda.. Think about it folks..people had packed and planned to go to Bermuda... Bermuda was about to be hit by a tropical storm...should NCL risk the lives of their passengers (read the fine print on the back of your contract).They were up until the time we were boarding working with their weather people. There was almost a near riot at the NY port...seriously.. people threatened to call the NY tv stations, girls were crying (I kid you not)..not one person thought about the poor people of Bermuda....This was not what I had planned either..we docked in Newport which is only one hour from our home, docked in Boston and stayed on the ship...no way to go home..and revisited Bar Harbor, St. John and Halifax... One passenger and I really have to smile to think of it.. had driven from Halifax to NYC.. to go to Bermuda for his birthday and he was sailing past his home in Halifax... Did NCL offer us any credit...no they didn't... So, missing one port for a problem on a ship.....one port..lol.. I missed a whole cruise to Bermuda.. AND YOU THINK YOU HAD A PROBLEM..... When you get a lemon.. make lemonade
  #46 (permalink)  
Old February 26th, 2010, 11:18 AM
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So, I guess we have all gotten the message now - that ships with pods sometimes have propulsion problems. Just as trains, cars and planes also sometimes have mechical problems.

The cruise lines have carefully crafted contracts that tell the guests they are not responsible for missed ports. In fact, even the US government has limited their status as carriers in the sense that they restrict cruise lines from doing one-way trips between US ports, for example, by requiring a visit to a distant foreign port during the voyage. The time on the ship is the vacation you are paying for, not the destinations they visit.

However, the US Congress has put cruise lines into the category of "common carrier" at times when it comes to liability for injuries at sea and crimes commited on ships. Just because something is in a contract does not mean it cannot be challenged.

But it isn't an easy challenge. I personally think arguments about what is "legally right" are secondary to the normal expectations people have in terms of that a cruise line will deliver.

Yes - a cruise ship would be crazy to go to Bermuda during a hurricane. No one would really want to go there if the captain said "well, that is what we promised so here we go."

But to cite a contract as an excuse for failure to deliver when the fault is purely due to mechanical difficulty by the cruise ship is a different story, but human expectations also have to be kept in check.

Yes, you have a right to be upset, but by the same token businesses under-delivering on a full promise is not that unusual. They are not going to close Disneyland or even give refunds just because one of the most popular rides is broken. Restaurants don't give away meals just because they run out the special. You still get to eat, you still have a good experience, etc.

If they offer you some compensation I don't know what else a person could expect from a cruise line. Especially if it is a discount on a future cruise. They are basically offering you a "make up" for what you missed. You got part of your vacation, but missed part of what you expected.

The best thing to do if you are still not happy is to have your travel agent negotiate something for you for a future cruise. This is one area where experienced, influential, high volume cruise agents can come in really handy. In addition to things like explaining the terms of the passenger contract to the client.

Before a passenger buys a cruise they ARE given a copy of that contract. Admittedly, no one wants to read all the fine print, but you still have to keep in mind the contract exists if you want to challenge the cruise line when something goes wrong. That means finesse in negotiations is probably going to go a lot farther than threats.
  #47 (permalink)  
Old February 26th, 2010, 11:41 AM
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How many c ruisers actually read their contract!! Never thought about asking for compensation because we so enjoyed Bermuda North.. It was several weeks before ships would return to Bermuda btw. Substituting Cartegena, Spain for Morocco was because of "unrest"..The only time I've asked for compensation was in Agadar when we had a tour guide from hell..and we did get it, but I would really have loved a tour without a lecture on Islam and being taken to special shops and not seeing the souk. There was a long line at the pursers office from our bus after that tour and others that day.
  #48 (permalink)  
Old February 28th, 2010, 05:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gardener46 View Post
As a one new to cruising (We just returned from a 14 day around the horn,on Infinity) I first posted last summer asking about cruising and what was best to see in ports. I had just signed up for this cruise,and paid a lot of money for air fare to South America and back. I wish I had checked this and other cruise pages before. We had no problems with the pods but we were lucky.We took this cruise to see things and found we did not care for days just cruising.We are veteran travelers and would have been more than disappointed if there had been problems.You ask about the ship, it is very much in need of a redo,the service was wonderful, the food was average to fair(too often cold)and the excursions wonderful to bad depending on the guide. I have not posted since my first posts due to the constant bickering here. You want new posters , address that. I was interested in true information , instead I got a major fight about Celebrity versus Princess--which had nothing to do with my question.You are right Paul most new people come here for information. I have enjoyed Chit Chat for cruisers as the group with Rollerdonna seem to have no agenda.
Gardener46,

Thanks for an unbiased report about one of the Celebrity Mclass ships. Reports about the older Celebrity ships needing a redo are common from cruisers who do not subscribe to a particular cruise line. I agree that these minor problems certainly can add up. I still believe in letting little things go and only worry about design problems or major problems on any cruise ship.

As Paul has said so many times, and I am sure that most readers would agree that a biased personal attack saying "your posts are saying a lot more about you than Celebrity", have no place on this board and I will refrain from making any comment. This board is far too valuable a resource for all to have that kind of stuff going on.

I wish to thank Paul and the cruisemates staff for allowing me to at least give readers an opportunity to make themselves aware of a possible problem that most cruisers, outside of the regulars on this board, are totally unaware of.

To return to the topic of this thread IMHO, considering everything, the Celebrity Mclass ships, with the possible exception of the Constellation, are in no way premium cruise ships. Now, the new ships just introduced by Celebrity, IMHO should be considered premium ships.

Debra
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Last edited by Nurse Debra; February 28th, 2010 at 05:22 PM.
  #49 (permalink)  
Old March 1st, 2010, 10:37 AM
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To return to the topic of this thread IMHO, considering everything, the Celebrity Mclass ships, with the possible exception of the Constellation, are in no way premium cruise ships. Now, the new ships just introduced by Celebrity, IMHO should be considered premium ships.

Debra[/QUOTE]

Getting back to the subject, I might point out that everyone is entitled to their opinion which Debra always gives however that opinion is not shared by the vast and large majority of cruisers on the M class ships. This has been shown for years by the various polls, readers surveys, etc. Debra may argue over the methodology of the presentations however when almost all given Celebrity's M class ships high marks.

Additionally, just to point out Constellation is in dry dock right now getting the S class treatment and Millenium was in drydock last year for major work.

Don
  #50 (permalink)  
Old March 1st, 2010, 10:39 AM
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FACTS! The main thing I and other new people are looking for--I feel it would be more than unethical when replying to questions about a cruise not to mention the pod problems if it applied--The Infinity sails to three destination areas---around the horn, Antarctica and Alaska--people go on these cruises to see the area--not to sit on the ship,(it is far too cold and windy to be on deck much on the cruise around the horn--I did not take enough warm clothing).Not to be informed of the pod problems when one asks for information is more than unethical.
  #51 (permalink)  
Old March 1st, 2010, 11:16 AM
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DKJRETIRED.. Guess I'm getting to be my like my mother...she used to say.. IT'S LIKE BANGING YOUR HEAD AGAINST THE WALL:-D
  #52 (permalink)  
Old March 1st, 2010, 12:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gardener46 View Post
FACTS! The main thing I and other new people are looking for--I feel it would be more than unethical when replying to questions about a cruise not to mention the pod problems if it applied--The Infinity sails to three destination areas---around the horn, Antarctica and Alaska--people go on these cruises to see the area--not to sit on the ship,(it is far too cold and windy to be on deck much on the cruise around the horn--I did not take enough warm clothing).Not to be informed of the pod problems when one asks for information is more than unethical.
No one says you shouldn't be informed of the pods but that wasn't the question asked in this thread. The pods are one part of the overall answer of whether the M class ships are "premium", whatever that means. Fact is that DESPITE the Pod problem, the M class ships are considered among the best ships in the large class category by a large majority of the cruising public and have been since they were launched.

Don
  #53 (permalink)  
Old March 1st, 2010, 05:14 PM
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If I had a nickel for every time I heard the expression "you are entitled to your own opinion, but you are not entitled to your own facts" in this last week I could buy a pack of cigarettes.

Here is the dealeo....

It is because of the fact that contracts do NOT guarantee destinations that I feel even more strongly that people should know the mechanical record of the ship when their primary reason for selecting a specific cruise is the ports of call.

If the destinations were guaranteed, at least I could say "you'll get to see what you are paying for one way or another" - but I can't say that.

If you love days at sea and don't care where the ship goes then you are a certain kind of cruiser, not an uncommon kind, but a specific kind. However, I do believe that most exotic cruises are taken by people who plan their cruise by the itinerary first.

This is only logical - if you do not care about the ports of call why would you book an exotic itinerary? Would you fly all the way to Indonesia and not get off the ship?

So - when the line promises exotic ports of call it seems like the ultimate copout to say "sorry we didn't get where you wanted to go, but you got your cruise anyway."

HOWEVER - by the same token few cruise lines do that. Most of them DO give some compensation for mechanical failure. I believe that deserves to be mentioned as well.

But here is the problem with cruise line compensation - even if you are compensated you will likely only receive compensation for what you missed on the cruise. The cruise line is not going to compensate you for airfare or time off work that went wasted. So you might very well end up flying to Australia and never seeing it. You may be compensated 1/2 the cost of the cruise but depending on why you selected this cruise that could be pretty unsatisfactory.

It's a mouthful, but unless you are willing to pay for someone's cruise if you recommend a ship and it breaks down, I wouldn't be so quick to say "oh, the ports don't matter." But you can say "the ports don't matter to me" - but don't imply the ships never break down.

Along the same line as "you are entitled to your own opinion but not your facts" there is another saying that is applicable...

"Statistics are meaningless to the minority." In other words, the ships may only break down 1% of the time, but if you are in that 1% you are a 100% victim of circumstances.

Posts like this are why people love us.
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Old March 1st, 2010, 05:44 PM
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It's ok to disagree, as long as there is no violence.

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  #55 (permalink)  
Old March 1st, 2010, 06:55 PM
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Nurse Debra,

Quote:
Originally Posted by You View Post
As Paul has said so many times, and I am sure that most readers would agree that a biased personal attack saying "your posts are saying a lot more about you than Celebrity", have no place on this board and I will refrain from making any comment. This board is far too valuable a resource for all to have that kind of stuff going on.
For the record, the statement that you boldfaced was not intended in any way as an attack. Rather, it was intended as a charitable effort to inform you how the overwhelming majority of readers are perceiving your comments. If it did not come across to you in that way, I'm sorry.

But the fact that my earlier comment did not come across to you as a charitable attempt to help you does not in any way alter the fact that the overwhelming majority of people who read your posts are taking them as a reflection on you rather than a reflection on Celebrity.

If you want to come across as sincere rather than vindictive, try posting something like this.

"The ships of the Millennium class have a legacy of propulsion pod failures that, at their peak, occurred about once per year per ship. When these failures occur, the ships operate at reduced speed until they can go into emergency drydock for repairs, potentially resulting in shortened or cancelled ports of call on one or two cruises before the emergency drydock when a failure occurs. The emergency drydock typically results in one cancelled cruise, for which the affected passengers historically have received a full refund of the cruise fare plus a certificate for a free cruise of equal duration. These failures have been considerably less frequent in recent years."

I think that if you were to make your point in these terms, it would be received far less unfavorably.

Norm.
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Old March 1st, 2010, 07:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rev22:17 View Post
Nurse Debra,



For the record, the statement that you boldfaced was not intended in any way as an attack. Rather, it was intended as a charitable effort to inform you how the overwhelming majority of readers are perceiving your comments. If it did not come across to you in that way, I'm sorry.

But the fact that my earlier comment did not come across to you as a charitable attempt to help you does not in any way alter the fact that the overwhelming majority of people who read your posts are taking them as a reflection on you rather than a reflection on Celebrity.

If you want to come across as sincere rather than vindictive, try posting something like this.

"The ships of the Millennium class have a legacy of propulsion pod failures that, at their peak, occurred about once per year per ship. When these failures occur, the ships operate at reduced speed until they can go into emergency drydock for repairs, potentially resulting in shortened or cancelled ports of call on one or two cruises before the emergency drydock when a failure occurs. The emergency drydock typically results in one cancelled cruise, for which the affected passengers historically have received a full refund of the cruise fare plus a certificate for a free cruise of equal duration. These failures have been considerably less frequent in recent years."

I think that if you were to make your point in these terms, it would be received far less unfavorably.

Norm.
Norm:

I agree with you, it is how you bring your point across that determines how it is received. Debra brought the pods up in a thread where a woman asked about the M class ships. It was done in an informative manner and the woman had a right to know the possibility of a pod problem. It is when someone asks a simple question like how much a drink costs and they get told about the pods, then it becomes ridiculous.
  #57 (permalink)  
Old March 1st, 2010, 08:17 PM
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Angry Ridiculous

This whole thing is RIDICULOUS because no matter where or when the integrity of Celebrity or a question about Celebrity is asked..this matter comes up over and over and over ad nauseum.......I'm just surprised it hasn't been brought up on the discussion of the new cuisine that has almost become a spoof and funlike... Seriously, I would like to see some of the comments ended or deleted...or a consequence far worse as several of us are trying to hint at."Posts like this are why people love us." NOT!! I think its the reason we are ALL very frustrated..delete this entire post ... please
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Old March 1st, 2010, 09:27 PM
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All I can say is that Norm wrote an excellent post.


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Equinox 4/11/2011
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Booked Allure of the Seas... 2 / 21 / 16 *Last Gang Cruise*
Booked Celebrity Equinox ... 4 / 4 / 16 *Anniversary cruise *
  #59 (permalink)  
Old March 2nd, 2010, 11:15 AM
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Default Oh please...

For heaven's sake, am I the only former "other cruise board" member who remembers Nurse Debra getting kicked off that board for creating the same mishigas? Didn't she "wear out her welcome" there, and was counseled repeatedly against this type of disturbance?

In the attempt to keep this as a board which offers "advice and facts without censorship", the only thing productive at this point it seems, is the drama which draws readers to the thread (hooray Cruisemates), but is this a positive approach to attract or keep readers? Think this may backfire? It's a shame when one poster can cause several readers to leave, including a moderator.

This is not an "attack" or a rant. I am simply offering the same valuable feedback as one other poster does, so that we all are aware.

Regarding the thread of pod issues, this is not the only glaring problem cruise lines face. I imagine that the Princess cruise we took last April which resulted in one missed port and delays should be announced daily, or for that matter, every time a poster mentions something good about the cruise line? Nope, didn't think so. That's different, isn't it? lol.

I agree with Norm, excellent post.

Lastly, I hope Celebrity finds their way to this board, and especially to the Celebrity forum. Would be interesting to see how they view the barrage of vindictive attacks. You can only turn a deaf ear for so long.

Last edited by Mermen; March 2nd, 2010 at 11:21 AM.
  #60 (permalink)  
Old March 2nd, 2010, 11:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mermen View Post
For heaven's sake, am I the only former "other cruise board" member who remembers Nurse Debra getting kicked off that board for creating the same mishigas? Didn't she "wear out her welcome" there, and was counseled repeatedly against this type of disturbance?

In the attempt to keep this as a board which offers "advice and facts without censorship", the only thing productive at this point it seems, is the drama which draws readers to the thread (hooray Cruisemates), but is this a positive approach to attract or keep readers? Think this may backfire? It's a shame when one poster can cause several readers to leave, including a moderator.

This is not an "attack" or a rant. I am simply offering the same valuable feedback as one other poster does, so that we all are aware.

Regarding the thread of pod issues, this is not the only glaring problem cruise lines face. I imagine that the Princess cruise we took last April which resulted in one missed port and delays should be announced daily, or for that matter, every time a poster mentions something good about the cruise line? Nope, didn't think so. That's different, isn't it? lol.

I agree with Norm, excellent post.

Lastly, I hope Celebrity finds their way to this board, and especially to the Celebrity forum. Would be interesting to see how they view the barrage of vindictive attacks. You can only turn a deaf ear for so long.
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