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Old November 20th, 2010, 05:28 PM
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Angry Tsa and flying to cruises

Is anybody else seriously being discouraged by flying and going through the TSA body search or the machines? Yes, I know we are being "protected" so they say. Last year I was disgusted to see an elderly frail woman in a wheel chair being manhandled at the Miami airport.. Parrot Pop because of knee replacement is always searched physically. Shoes off, small amount of liquids, make up opened, and I can go on and on and you can't even complain ,or grimace (they make the exam twice as long) I for one am tired of this. The problem is that Israel has the answers to being protected, but nobody is listening
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Old November 20th, 2010, 05:41 PM
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I too am not happy about the searches and restrictions that go with flying these days, but I think if you want to fly, its the price we all have to pay to be safer.
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Old November 20th, 2010, 05:52 PM
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I will be flying next wed, and I plan to go with what everyone else has to go through.

I am afraid it is the sign of the times, and I would much rather be groped than to fall out of the sky.
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Old November 20th, 2010, 06:41 PM
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The problem is that Israel has the answers to being protected, but nobody is listening
The thing is, Israel has only one airport to man with appropriately trained security people. Being so efficient didn't happen overnight in Israel either. It used to be that everyone entering or leaving Israel had their luggage opened, and inspected by hand.

It also has measures in place so they are most often aware of "risky travelers" before they even reach the airport.

The USA doesn't have the resources either financially, or with manpower, to get fully trained security people at all the airports in the country.

It is WAY too much of a simplification to point at the Isaeli example...though the talking heads on TV talk about it as though you just have to flip a switch.
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Old November 20th, 2010, 07:48 PM
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Flying 4 times in just a few weeks, all I had to do was walk through, and I beeped just once..no pat down or the, "I see you naked scan"

I have to say, given the choice, pat me down....I may not like it, but, go ahead, and, make us safe...
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Old November 20th, 2010, 09:28 PM
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It will supposedly be selective screening
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Old November 20th, 2010, 09:54 PM
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"The USA doesn't have the resources either financially, or with manpower, to get fully trained security people at all the airports in the country." Neither do other European countries and I've heard Europeans in TSA lines saying they don't do this in their countries..Maybe if we had paid and trained these TSA agents in the beginning there wouldn't be a problem.. It does seem funny that they take away for example knives....yet on the plane when your served a meal they give you a full set of METAL utensils.. I do know originally an Israeli company was to train TSA in Boston but the powers that be deemed it too $$$.. I only hope this week there is a major slow down of lines and that fliers rebel. I don't agree that patting down physically almost every flyer (Parrot Pop is done each time) that it is going to make us safer. A new machine is being installed in Logan Airport, the first of it's kind and I hope it makes flying and the experience a bit more pleasant in these times.
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Old November 20th, 2010, 10:18 PM
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Israeli airport officials are trained to visually scan passengers' faces for warning signs, such as nervous tics or excessive sweating. Those deemed suspicious are then subject to further questioning and possibly a search. Training airport officials to examine a passenger's body language and behaviour could help identify potential threats that other high-tech screening methods might miss.
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Old November 20th, 2010, 10:27 PM
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El Al Airlines is the safest to travel in my opinion .From what I've been told their security is excellent at Ben Gurion airport as well as the smaller commercial airports .
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Old November 20th, 2010, 11:16 PM
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El Al Airlines is the safest to travel in my opinion .From what I've been told their security is excellent at Ben Gurion airport as well as the smaller commercial airports .
I can tell you from personal experience at Logan Airport years ago they scrutinize the entire area from above, then walk the area asking questions, and if somebody looked suspicious and didn't fit into their profile they asked him into a private area..and this was approx 25 years ago.
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Old November 20th, 2010, 11:54 PM
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Since flying has gotten to be such a pain, we drove to our last cruise and will be driving to our next two cruises as well.

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Old November 21st, 2010, 02:58 AM
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the first line of defensive starts prior to arriving to an airport which would mean gathering of more personal information at the time of reservation/payment for one's air ticket, 72 hours or more in advance ..then there should be a series of screenings, some known, some unknown to the travel public..the pat down is just a visible sign

the issue IMHO is that if a person (or organization) is determine ,he/she will be very hard to stop...

as an open society, we have to figure out what level of support we will provide in order to continue to travel be it air, rail, bus etc. as the OKC incident showed, it could be anybody

I have no objection to the pat down as an alternate to the machine scanning
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Old November 21st, 2010, 03:57 AM
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Until our government decides that profiling is a "good thing", then innocents will be subjected to pat downs, etc.

I have been subjected to pat downs well before the the last month..........and it didn't bother me at all. I even joked with them that this would be the most "feeling up" I would have this year.......got smiles and apologies.

El Al basically has one airport of International entry in Israel. The USA has numerous airports of international entry.....even if that means the Bahamas or Canada.

And I totally agree with Venice!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Old November 21st, 2010, 04:01 AM
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BTW ParrottMom - I have never received a full set of METAL utensils even flying in first class the last 3 years.
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Old November 21st, 2010, 04:21 AM
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BTW ParrottMom - I have never received a full set of METAL utensils even flying in first class the last 3 years.
We have on Swiss Air on our last two flights in economy class too..
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Old November 21st, 2010, 09:47 AM
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Originally Posted by Lisa View Post
BTW ParrottMom - I have never received a full set of METAL utensils even flying in first class the last 3 years.
We have received a full set of Metal utensils on several airlines while flying over the Atlantic.

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Old November 21st, 2010, 11:06 AM
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There was a story yesterday about a guy at an airport who was wearing a colostomy bag and how horribly he was treated at the airport .
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Old November 21st, 2010, 11:23 AM
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Old November 21st, 2010, 11:27 AM
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Having just been through this 4 times in the past week (Halifax, Toronto, Ft. Lauderdale, Montreal) with layovers, it was a pain to say the least.
This was the first time traveling since my hubby got a pacemaker put in, and he had to submit to a thorough body search each time. In Ft. Lauderdale coming home, he even had to take off his shirt in order to replace his suspenders and nearly lost his pants!

As for me, I was traveling with "lethal" large plastic knitting needles in my carry-on luggage. I even printed out a TSA advisory that knitting needles were permitted on flights, just in case, but nobody even checked or said a thing.

If I could possibly cruise without flying to a port I would, but for the moment, it is an unavoidable necessity...

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Old November 21st, 2010, 11:34 AM
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okay, i know it's a sick sense of humor, but i must tell you.. when we left Boston for Zurich Parrot Pop was suffering from food poisoning. As they were patting him down he needed to use a pail to 'upchuck'....there were three TSA around... Silently i sat by and and laughed to myself...

Last edited by Parrot Mom; November 21st, 2010 at 11:50 AM.
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Old November 21st, 2010, 11:53 AM
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I've had the pat downs for the last three years because of my pacemaker. I have not had a problem with being treated badly, disrespectfully nor has it caused an excessive delay.

I have seen people acting like complete jerks because they require a pat down. Two weeks ago, in Miami, a man treated the TSA agent very disrespectfully going as far as swearing at him. The agent did nothing to bring on this treatment and acted professionaly throughout the entire time. I know I would not have had that patience and grandpa would have been in a private screening room in thirty seconds. I believe many of the people who have or have had issues with the TSA also contributed to the problem.

For eighteen months I wore a colostomy bag. Though this was in the early nineties, and it never caused a travel problem, I always thought how easy it would be to smuggle stuff in it or put explosives in it. Who would want to check it. A real, or fake, colostomy bag would be a great way for a terrorist to get explosives or other stuff on board. I can understand why extra attention is given to this.

I am far from a lemming but when you are going to board something that is basically an eighty ton bomb that could kill hundreds on board and even more on the ground you take the precautions that you can to make sure it doesn't blow up. It's already happened.

I also wonder if people think that a pat down or a scan is such a major problem and inconvenience how do these people handle "real" problems in their life.

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Old November 21st, 2010, 12:00 PM
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Must tell you that Parrot Pop has a great sense of humor and this time asked for a women TSA agent to do the pat down and he has had a colostomy bag, but we werent' flying then.
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Old November 21st, 2010, 08:25 PM
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Here's what I find amusing about some of these folks who scream they don't want to be " touched " while fully clothed at the airport when they fly to board a cruise ship---
They don't want to be touched at the airport but once aboard ship, they will pay a ton of dollars and even make reservations days in advance to have a total stranger rub on them for an hour at a time, many times with just a towel covering their rear end. Go figure.
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Old November 21st, 2010, 09:08 PM
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Quote:
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Here's what I find amusing about some of these folks who scream they don't want to be " touched " while fully clothed at the airport when they fly to board a cruise ship---
They don't want to be touched at the airport but once aboard ship, they will pay a ton of dollars and even make reservations days in advance to have a total stranger rub on them for an hour at a time, many times with just a towel covering their rear end. Go figure.
Yes, people can be weird and uncooperative.

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Old November 21st, 2010, 09:38 PM
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Nudity is the answer
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Old November 22nd, 2010, 07:44 PM
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Nudity is the answer
Whatever it takes to keep us safe!

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Old November 22nd, 2010, 08:11 PM
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Neither the scan nor the heavy pat down bother me. My wife on the otherhand is rather pissed about the whole thing. Just to be clear, I welcome all the help I can get.
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Old November 22nd, 2010, 08:17 PM
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"For eighteen months I wore a colostomy bag. Though this was in the early nineties, and it never caused a travel problem, I always thought how easy it would be to smuggle stuff in it or put explosives in it. Who would want to check it. A real, or fake, colostomy bag would be a great way for a terrorist to get explosives or other stuff on board. I can understand why extra attention is given to this." THERE was the incident today where a man had his colostomy bag broken by the TSA..he was mortified. The thoughts of going through the airport wet and smelling...supposedly TSA will be dealing with this..For a short time years ago Parrot Pop had one and always felt it had an odor..it did not. Interesting in that one of my clients that works for a large travel agency has decided NOT to fly to SF but to fly for her Thanksgiving vacation this week.. I think in the future more and more people will be driving or taking buses to ports close to their home.. I know I will.
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Old November 22nd, 2010, 08:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Parrot Mom View Post
THERE was the incident today where a man had his colostomy bag broken by the TSA..he was mortified. The thoughts of going through the airport wet and smelling.
It was a urostomy bag for collecting urine due to bladder cancer.

Sawyer's Nov. 7 experience...The TSA boss apologized..." A retired special education teacher who said he was left humiliated, crying and covered with his own urine after an enhanced pat-down at airport security said he received an apology Monday in a phone call from Transportation Security Administration chief John Pistole.
“First he apologized,” said Thomas D. “Tom” Sawyer, 61, of Lansing, Mich. “And I thanked him. Then I told him off a bit. And he said, ‘Tell me more. What do you think needs to be done?’ ”Sawyer said that he suggested to Pistole that TSA screeners undergo more training to better understand travelers with medical conditions."

But there was this tidbit from the past that the TSA could claimis the reason they have to do what they do......
TSA: Rapper Had 6,000 Ecstasy Pills At Airport
Man Told Screener He Had Colostomy Bag, U.S. Attorney Says
POSTED: 4:26 pm PDT July 24, 2008
UPDATED: 8:09 pm PDT July 24, 2008

 
SACRAMENTO, Calif. -- A Vallejo-based rapper was arrested earlier this month after apparently trying to hide 6,000 Ecstasy pills in his clothes before boarding a plane, U.S. Attorney McGregor W. Scott said.
Steven Noel Davison, 34, who performs under the names "PSD," "PSD tha Drivah," and "Stevie Dee," was trying to board an ExpressJet flight at Sacramento International Airport on July 14, when he was pre-screened by the Transportation Security Administration agents.
Screeners did a pat search on him and found a bulge in his pants inside his inner right leg, authorities said.
Davison told the agents it was a colostomy bag, then tried to leave twice before he was taken to a private screening area, Scott said." end
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Last edited by Phil&Liz; November 22nd, 2010 at 08:50 PM.
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Old November 23rd, 2010, 07:04 PM
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Kuki,

Quote:
Originally Posted by You View Post
The thing is, Israel has only one airport to man with appropriately trained security people.
That's not quite accurate.

Israel has security mesures in place at every airport to which El Al flies.

Quote:
Originally Posted by You
It also has measures in place so they are most often aware of "risky travelers" before they even reach the airport.
That is the key.

Quote:
Originally Posted by You
The USA doesn't have the resources either financially, or with manpower, to get fully trained security people at all the airports in the country.
The Israeli approach is actually much less costly than inspecting everybody. By identifying potential threats in advance so the airport staff can focus on a handful of individuals in that category, their method requires a lot fewer screeners and a lot less equipment at the airport. Much of the required intelligence already exists at various national agencies, so it's just a question of tapping into it.

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