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Old May 2nd, 2011, 04:55 AM
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Default Monday, Time to Vote!

Morning Mates, it's voting day here in Canada, with yet another Federal election. We may have a new Prime Minister, or at least a new opposition party by the end of the day, we shall see....

I am up at the ungodly hour of 5:30 am because I am working the polls today, I have to be there at 7:30 to set up and open the poll, and can't leave until after the polls close at 8:30 tonight, then I have to deliver the ballots to the Returning Office around 9pm or so. It will be a very long day and I'm sure I will be exhausted, but the pay is good for 1 day!

Wishing you all a good start to your week, and better weather than the dull and cold we are still experiencing here. 5C or 41F today, with rain...

If you're a Canuck, get out and VOTE!

edited to add: just heard the news that must be rejoiced around the U.S. and the world - Bin Laden is dead! Finally, closure....

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Old May 2nd, 2011, 08:42 AM
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Good morning from a much needed rainy day in Texas. We went from the upper 80's to the 40's in a few hours yesterday.

I sit here with mixed feelings this morning. One part of me is happy and relieved that the evil one is now gone, but I also feel so very bad for those who he had something to do with killing. I guess the question I have is WHY?

Today starts my last full week with my BFF. If you have never had to go through something like this, then you have no idea what it is like. It is so important to remember everything about them, in case they don't come back. Hugs are important. Smiles through tears are remembered, and your heart over flows with love. Although I have said many times I wished he didn't have to go, I have never asked him to not go. When I married Jim 27 years ago, I also married the Army. I knew that they would take first place from time to time, and I accepted it.

So, My POA is up to date, and the will is new, so once again I have to smile through the tears, so if that is the last time he sees me, he will have one more smile to take to Heaven with him.

Please pray for our troops today, and in the coming days. One evil is gone, but there are many others. I know that people will no doubt talk about the expense, but this is an all volenteer force, and they give their lives everyday, for yours.

God Bless Us All.
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Old May 2nd, 2011, 08:57 AM
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My heart is with you and Jim as well you know, Luanne. God Bless Jim and we wish him God Speed.

Navy Seal Team Six has covered itself and along with them, the entire country with glory. The professionalism of our military is that only 40 men (and of them only 24 men actually entered the compound/fortress) did not even suffer injury.

I am a student of the military and I always believed that a special ops team would get Bin Laden when the time came.

I am so glad this operation was done surgically and one should never forget the fact that this man, considered a Hero by millions, used a woman as a human shield. What a coward. It should also be understood, that the development of this information started years ago from, of all places, GITMO. Now people understand why it was not closed.

Finally, it should be noted that this man was living actually near a Pakistani Military Academy.

It is truly a great day for America!
Todd
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Old May 2nd, 2011, 09:32 AM
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Morning all. It's the start of another wet week here. I have a little time to myself this morning. Yay.

Luanne, my thoughts and best wishes are with you and your husband. I hope you'll be able ot enjoy the remaining time before he ships off.

Donna, you are going to have a long day but I hope it flies by.

I hope you all have a wonderful day.
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Old May 2nd, 2011, 10:15 AM
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Good morning from a mild and sunny Chicago! Hope all is well, have a great day!
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Old May 2nd, 2011, 10:22 AM
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I was debating with myself as to whether I post on the OBL thread .However after conferring with 3 people ,I have decided to do so.
A friend of mine a retired law enforcement person wonders why OBL was shot in the face and buried at sea. Could it have been that perhaps he would implicate certain Americans re 911 ? My friend said this reminds him of Jack Ruby and Lee Harvey Oswald .
I received an e-mail today from a friend who is a Vietnam veteran and who is a retired Chief Of Police in a NJ town .His feeling is that OBL may have taken credit for something that others were involved ,perhaps prominent members of the american political government in the last administration .
Concurring with these 2 is someone I know currently in US law enforcement .

While I do not necessarily subscribe to the theory ,it still raises questions .

As far as supporting the troops .I support those to say "hell no ,I refuse to die for oil and other business interests" .My law enforcement friend said it reminds him of the Gulf Of Tonkin which supposedly gave this country the right to enter into Vietnam .
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Old May 2nd, 2011, 10:59 AM
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Henry, I am not shocked at what you have to say, as I know you are anti Military, and support a web site that makes excuses for Jane Fonda, but I am saddend by your words.

I feel so sorry for you. The coldness in your heart must be noted.

Take care everyone... Paul, Mike, Kuki, Thank you so much for being a part of my life during some good times, and really rough ones.

Please join me on Facebook...

I love you all.

Luanne
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Old May 2nd, 2011, 11:46 AM
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Luanne..my prayers for Jim's safety...well done Navy SEALS and to the efforts over the last 10 years of everyone in both the intelligence community and the military for their efforts..Henry, I'll send you a "pm"
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Old May 2nd, 2011, 11:48 AM
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Henry your post is not in the correct thread, one which I have not seen.

Luanne, I am so sorry that a post such as that was made and I am sure that the majority of people here do not want you to leave.
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Old May 2nd, 2011, 12:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Henry43 View Post
I was debating with myself as to whether I post on the OBL thread .However after conferring with 3 people ,I have decided to do so.
A friend of mine a retired law enforcement person wonders why OBL was shot in the face and buried at sea. Could it have been that perhaps he would implicate certain Americans re 911 ? My friend said this reminds him of Jack Ruby and Lee Harvey Oswald .
I received an e-mail today from a friend who is a Vietnam veteran and who is a retired Chief Of Police in a NJ town .His feeling is that OBL may have taken credit for something that others were involved ,perhaps prominent members of the american political government in the last administration .
Concurring with these 2 is someone I know currently in US law enforcement .

While I do not necessarily subscribe to the theory ,it still raises questions .

As far as supporting the troops .I support those to say "hell no ,I refuse to die for oil and other business interests" .My law enforcement friend said it reminds him of the Gulf Of Tonkin which supposedly gave this country the right to enter into Vietnam .
WOW! That was just uncalled for.
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Old May 2nd, 2011, 12:52 PM
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Luanne, I am sorry that you feel the need to leave. Please know that you are in my prayers daily. I will be sure to say hello on FB. Please know that the door is always open at CTC.

Laura
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Old May 2nd, 2011, 01:14 PM
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Good afternoon. What a strange day! I'm glad and proud of our military and the special ops for what they have done.

Luanne, this has to be an especially hard day for you with all that's going on, and saying good bye to Jim one more time, but know that most of us here love and support you and your family.

I join the others who have said this is not the time or place for conspiracy theories.

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Old May 2nd, 2011, 01:30 PM
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I am not one to get involved in American politics, but surely this OBL news goes far beyond anything political.

While I am happy that he has been dealt with .... the fear for me, is retalliation. As Todd said above, he was a hero to millions, so I have to ask, what next? I pray that is a question I don't find an answer to.



Donna, yes! Votin day is here. I need to find a way to fit that in to my day. I have no clue where my voting station is and I need to figure that out.
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Old May 2nd, 2011, 02:11 PM
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Please allow me to say that I am not leaving CM. I am no longer going to post on this part of it.

To me, CM is still the best cruise web site on the net. It taught me about cruising, and that information assured that we had the best cruises possible.

I encourage all of you to continue to post, and to share in your lives, with everyone. I have learned so much from each of you about your town, state, and your beloved families.

The reason I won't be posting is that I know that no matter what I say, I will still get the evil I received this morning.

My life, as I have said, is the wonderful military. My blood runs OD green. My heart is in the right place, and my love for each of you is real.

Although I was mad, and then hurt this morning, I ask each of you, to put Henry in your prayers. I have been praying for him for months now, and that will not change.
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Old May 2nd, 2011, 02:51 PM
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I don't post on here often, but today I feel I must.

Luanne, I have admired you for quite a while now. I was enthralled reading about your trip to Germany and all the memories it brought back. I felt privileged to have read what you wrote. I also learned so much from you when you lost your son. I was praying for you daily, and have been amazed by your strength! I am was also a military wife for 10 years. Now my DH works as a contractor with navies from all the NATO countries, so he still travels constantly and I am very proud of what he has done to keep our world safe. No one knows the rigors of a military wife like fellow military wives!

Now, while I may not always agree with others politics or views in general, I respect their right to have them. However, when people choose to say things that are mean and hurtful, then it's just wrong. Our military members - and their families - dedicate their lives to protecting our country and all it's citizens, even when those same people vilify those same soldiers, sailors, marines, etc... That's sad, but everyone has a right to express their opinion, thanks to the same brave men and women who are being criticized!

Thanks to all the military members who serve and protect every day, and to every one of their family members.

Terri
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Old May 2nd, 2011, 02:56 PM
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You are a wonderful woman Luanne.
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Old May 2nd, 2011, 03:07 PM
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Luanne:

We have personally e-mailed and you know about my childhood loss to violence ."Venice" ,you know it as well as have everyone who I e-mail with or converse by telephone..
I do not condone violence ,period .
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Old May 3rd, 2011, 12:19 AM
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Okay, I've just got to throw my two cents in on this conspiracy stuff.

Probably one of the first of the more modern conspiracy theories out there is that Franklin Roosevelt knew Japan was going to bomb Pearl Harbor. Up until the seventies, a respected historian believed that and even put it in a book (which I have somewhere). I don't think he was ever able to have anything published thereafter. Now this was a successful author. The trouble is, people get so involved with conspiracies that they often lose all common sense if indeed they had that much with which to start.

Roosevelt ALWAYS wanted the Japanese to take the first shot. Problem is, the experts agreed it would come somewhere in then Malaysia or maybe even the Philippines. Let's just say that nut case of an author had a point and we'll say that Roosevelt may have known the hit would come at Pearl. He could even have allowed that but I double damn guarantee you that there would have been almost no ships and only a few aircraft on the ground when it came. The carriers then at sea could have been arranged on an interception track at a time that the Japanese carriers had few aircraft or CAP (Combat Air Patrols) up since they believed their location was completely unknown (as indeed it was). It would have been the perfect set up job. He could have sunk most of the Japanese task force before the aircraft ever returned to their carriers. In short, had he really known, he could have had his cake and eaten it at the same time and the war in the Pacific would have probably been over before it even started.

The big Kahuna however, came with the Kennedy Assassination. Now I believe there could well have been a conspiracy there and some day we'll know for sure. But not until 2063 an I dare say most of us won't be around. I have no idea who was involved and wouldn't hazard a guess because those who do, again, have absolutely no concrete proof to back up their particular theory. A few have made what I think were good guesses, but maybe but that's it. I for one have always thought it may well have been a mob hit because it had all the hallmarks of something of that nature. But I don't know and those who do won't be talking.

Since then it seems that everything of any consequence has to involve a conspiracy and it almost always involves the government.

I don't care if they're a combat Vet, I don't care if they're a police chief, I don't care if they're a Senator but in my opinion, anyone who believes the government was involved in a conspiracy over 911 or even the UBL take down at the very least, needs some heavy doses of medication.

The idea that we blew up the Twin Towers after the planes hit them really is patently absurd. Why? Because anyone who has studied anything about how those buildings were built knows that couldn't have happened on 9/11. I've heard some claim the buildings were actually blown up because they came straight down. If anyone had taken the time to do basic high school research they would know that modern skyscrapers are specifically designed, whether it be due to a terrific earthquake, planes crashing into them whatever, to basically pancake, which in effect is what the twin towers did. If they were blown up as some theorists claim, would have to have meant that the terrorists flying the planes (who could not even land them if they wanted to and knew just enough to keep them airborne and on the right headings) could specifically crash them into a specific floor. Hell, one went in at an almost forty degree angle! when you drop a building, any building, especially one of those sizes, you have numerous little explosions that are readily visible to anyone watching. The only "blasts" were those created right at the level of the fire when the buildings started down. One did start off at an angle on the upper floors because the steel on that side melted and gave way unevenly but the rest of the building pancaked as it was always designed to do.

We honor our military but let's get serious. Whether we like it or not, military vets including combat vets have been involved in horrific and violent crimes, spent their lives in mental hospitals for various reasons, etc., etc. The military is no more nor less than a cross section of society. There are hundreds and hundreds of lawmen serving sentences for everything from murder to corruption. Doesn't it stand to reason that there are some out there who would be considered by many to be flakes? Absolutely! I have visited a website, many members of which are disgruntled vets that are nothing but not only absurd, but so ridiculously absurd to make the average "reasonable" individual laugh. And for the record, the law defines "reasonable" as what the average thinking individual would do in like or similar circumstances. Does the average individual think we were involved in the twin towers or were in some way covering up governmental duplicity by killing UBL? Tell you what. Have a good polling organization run a pole asking those questions. Everyone is more than welcome to their opinion, but if you get ridiculous, then you best be able to take what is definitely going to come your way. I have seen such people literally make jackasses out of themselves on national television for years. there are some who are so off the wall that were you to put them on stage the audience would think they were comics and laugh their heads off.

Do people have alternative opinions of an event? Of course, but at least have the common sense to back up your argument with at least a bare minimum of facts not coincidences!

Todd

Last edited by ToddDH; May 3rd, 2011 at 12:24 AM.
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Old May 3rd, 2011, 10:56 AM
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Bravo todd!!!!!!!!!!!
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Old May 3rd, 2011, 11:03 AM
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FBI says, "No hard evidence connecting Bin Laden to 9/11"

Reread this full article, reprinted at 911truth.org from Muckraker (no longer available online) here: http://www.911truth.org/article.php?story=20060611155014535

Courtesy of The Muckraker Report

June 6, 2006 -- This past weekend, a thought provoking e-mail circulated through Internet news groups, and was sent to the Muckraker Report by Mr. Paul V. Sheridan (Winner of the 2005 Civil Justice Foundation Award), bringing attention to the FBI's Most Wanted Terrorist web page for Usama Bin Laden.[1] (See bottom of this web page for Most Wanted page) In the e-mail, the question is asked, "Why doesn't Usama Bin Laden's Most Wanted poster make any direct connection with the events of September 11, 2001?" The FBI says on its Bin Laden web page that Usama Bin Laden is wanted in connection with the August 7, 1998 bombings of the United States Embassies in Dar es Salaam, Tanzania, and Nairobi, Kenya. According to the FBI, these attacks killed over 200 people. The FBI concludes its reason for "wanting" Bin Laden by saying, "In addition, Bin Laden is a suspect in other terrorists attacks throughout the world."

On June 5, 2006, the Muckraker Report contacted the FBI Headquarters, (202) 324-3000, to learn why Bin Laden's Most Wanted poster did not indicate that Usama was also wanted in connection with 9/11. The Muckraker Report spoke with Rex Tomb, Chief of Investigative Publicity for the FBI. When asked why there is no mention of 9/11 on Bin Laden's Most Wanted web page, Tomb said, "The reason why 9/11 is not mentioned on Usama Bin Laden's Most Wanted page is because the FBI has no hard evidence connecting Bin Laden to 9/11." (emphasis added)

Once again ,I did NOT say I subscribe to the theory of US involvement .I merely stated that prominent respected americans do subscribe to the theory .
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Old May 3rd, 2011, 07:32 PM
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Henry,

Number one, anyone who draws the conculsions you imply based upon things such as the wording of an FBI Wanted poster are among a thousand other things (none of which are complimentary) is a Defense Attorney's dream!

You were a Fraud investigator so you know the difference between direct evidence (such as a written document, an eyewitness who observes the crime literally occur, a weapon, etc.) and indirect (or circumstantial) evidence).

I am quite sure that many will recall Bin Laden's bragging about the crime. Trouble is, people throughout history have bragged about crimes they didn't commit (even though we know he did commit it and a jury, contrary to popular belief can convict based solely on circumstantical evidence in fact most convictions arise from just that).

Anyone and I mean anyone, who would use something such as the remarks by "Muckraker" (appropriate name if ever there was one) about what was written and why, on an FBI poster, is nothing less than totally preposterous. You're saying that law enforcement officers and even one police chief you know believe (or at least you allude to that) that we were somehow involved or probably involved in the events of 9/11 or Bin Laden's death and are citing such preposterous evidence? It's a legal joke, Henry, truly a joke. You merely proved my point. Just like in every field there are law enforcement officers and police chiefs with the common sense of a goldfish.

Your FBI quote actually is the best proof possible for my point. There was no DIRECT evidence, no note, no orders, no nothing that he was behind the 9/11 attacks at least in the possession of the FBI. The government could well have it, but even the FBI isn't going to know about it unless the CIA or NSA releases something now that the guys with the "70 Virginians" they found such as when they took all the intel out of his home last Saturday night and then I'd be kinda' surprised if they even released it then. Why? Simply because it's TOTALLY UNNECESSARY! They have tons of direct evidence to have put him in front of a firing squad for a whole host of (come to think of it..............).

If you were to put on your analytical hat, I am quite positive that you wouldn't just say you are NOT saying you subscribe to the theory but based upon not only your formal training but basic everyday common sense, would also find such theories preposterous. By virtue of your going to the trouble of posting something such as you did that you appear at least to be leaning in that direction does indeed trouble me.

IMHO, people who subsribe to these types of beliefs should not be described as "Prominent" but I believe rather they should be described as "notorious" and as for "respected?," certainly not by any learned person including a whale of a lot of truly prominent and better yet "respected" people and law enforcement officers whom I've the honor to have known and or worked alongside in my career. True professionals wouldn't even waste their time even reading such stuff.

BTW, I spent over 27 years in a law enforcement career and never heard of the Civil Justice Foundation. Hey there, a high falutin' name! Then it hit me....the word "Civil." It it's a "civil justice" why are these people held to the same standard and the same manner one would a "criminal justice foundation?" Could this 501C-3 organization by any chance have anything to do with Community Action?

I hope you rethink your position, I really really do.

Todd
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Old May 3rd, 2011, 11:17 PM
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All I am suggesting is that people keep an open mind . When I was in college I had a history class project in which we had to take a proven fact and disprove it .I chose the assassination of Abraham Lincoln . I found enough evidence to write a 10 page paper that Booth may not have been the assassin .

Hundreds of books have been written about the John Kennedy assassination with numerous people other that Lee Harvey Oswald as the assassin.
Likewise numerous books have been written about the deaths of Robert Kennedy ,Malcolm X and Dr.Martin Luther King ,Jr .

Are we to believe that Jerry Rubin was the victim of a hit and run driver ,never found ? Are we to believe that Abbie Hoffman committed suicide ? Neither his wife ,brother or children do .

I am merely advancing a theory that many people have implied or suggested that OBL took credit for something that either he was not responsible for or that he was not totally responsible for to be deified by the arab world .Don't forget that this was a highly educated man educated in the western world who was not always loved by the muslim community .

There is a theory among many people in this country that a group of politicians and business people actually control the events of this country ,similiar to what was portrayed on the TV show 24 by John Voight .

Is this possible ?I have no idea but in view of everything that has happened especially from 1963 to 1969 ,I think possibly .
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