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  #271 (permalink)  
Old January 23rd, 2012, 12:05 PM
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Default Royal Caribbean Comments on Safety

All of us at Royal Caribbean International continue to extend our heartfelt sympathies to those affected by Carnival Corporation's recent tragic incident on the Costa Concordia. As a Crown & Anchor Society member and loyal Royal Caribbean guest, we know you may have some questions as the situation continues to unfold.

At Royal Caribbean International, the safety and security of our guests and crew is our highest priority. It is fundamental to our operations. Our maritime safety record over our 42-year history illustrates our commitment to the safety of the millions of guests and crew that sail on our ships. The measures we take in the interest of safety are many, often exceeding the regulatory requirements these are all part of our ongoing commitment to innovation and continuous improvement in every aspect of our business.

To address some of your questions and concerns, here is a video that will provide an overview of safety onboard our ships; the training of our crew, officers and captains; and the many regulations that govern our practices.
Click here to watch.

As a past cruiser, we know your friends and family may be asking about your own time at sea. We hope that you'll share this video along with your personal Royal Caribbean experiences with them, and reinforce that cruising continues to maintain the best safety record of any industry in travel.

Thank you for your continued support and we look forward to welcoming you aboard again soon on one of our ships sailing to 270 destinations worldwide.

Sincerely,

Adam Goldstein
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  #272 (permalink)  
Old January 24th, 2012, 01:18 AM
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Port is left and red
Starboard is right green

aft and stern will get you to the same place the back of the ship

International Maritime Law requires a lifeboat drill within 24 hours of sailing
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  #273 (permalink)  
Old January 25th, 2012, 01:05 AM
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Originally Posted by Paul Motter View Post
Andrew, I am not sure where that picture came from, but it shows the captain turning a different direction that what we saw before, and it also implies drifting.

I understand things can change - but they really need to nail down what happened - what actions did the captain take?

As far as a lady being on the bridge being a "no no" - I can tell you I have been on many cruise ship bridges, it is not disallowed to have guests on the bridge. I have been on bridges for hours at a time before.
I've got it fron NavSim website (a company that, among other things, manufactures navigation software). This is a Polish-based company so I guess it's not so well known around the world).

Anyways, I've been monitoring they website for a while and recently they've published two interesting things:
1. Reconstruction of Costa Concordi track; and
2. Electronic charts that are available for the area of Giglio.

I found it quite convincing (especially I combined it with news from other forums/websites e.g. the one of Chief Mechanic of Costa Concordia, which confirms that the engines where off almost immediately after they hit the rocks). Therefore I think that the "courageus manouvre" that saved hundreds of lives was just a mere coincident. If the wind were e.g. SE instead of NNE then we won't be seeing Costa Concordia grounding at rocks but she would be now somewhere deep in the ocean couple of miles away from Gilgio.
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  #274 (permalink)  
Old January 25th, 2012, 10:59 AM
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Tell me this isn't so ...........


I read on Facebook, that Costa has offered a 30% discount on future cruise bookings to the guests who were on the Concordia.


Really? Well, aint that a slap in the face.
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  #275 (permalink)  
Old January 25th, 2012, 11:07 AM
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No, they didn't. That has been offered to all who are booked on Concordia til the end of March. Costa has offered full refunds on any of their ships that are booked for those who have decided they don't want to cruise at this time. They have until February 7th to decide.

Costa has been back peddling on a lot of the help or lack thereof over the last couple of days. However, they did not offer 30% discount to those involved, only to those on future sailings.
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  #276 (permalink)  
Old January 25th, 2012, 11:40 AM
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Originally Posted by andrew121 View Post
I've got it fron NavSim website (a company that, among other things, manufactures navigation software). This is a Polish-based company so I guess it's not so well known around the world).

Anyways, I've been monitoring they website for a while and recently they've published two interesting things:
1. Reconstruction of Costa Concordi track; and
2. Electronic charts that are available for the area of Giglio.

I found it quite convincing (especially I combined it with news from other forums/websites e.g. the one of Chief Mechanic of Costa Concordia, which confirms that the engines where off almost immediately after they hit the rocks). Therefore I think that the "courageus manouvre" that saved hundreds of lives was just a mere coincident. If the wind were e.g. SE instead of NNE then we won't be seeing Costa Concordia grounding at rocks but she would be now somewhere deep in the ocean couple of miles away from Gilgio.
I see exactly what the site implies - that the ship lost power and drifted into the shore. Why this captain did not put up a Mayday immediately is to me as egregious than his "abandoning ship" yet it is hardly even being discussed.

A dead ship in the water - upright - is made to be fully escapable by everyone within 30 minutes.
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  #277 (permalink)  
Old January 25th, 2012, 11:58 AM
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That second video is really dramatic. I saw a similar tracking video on YouTube last week that showed the ship turning around to port (not starboard) causing it to lean to starboard when it hit the ground.

A lot of web site theorized that ship had a keel effect where its own underwater wash reflecting off the shore pushed the keel out away from the shore and caused the original list.

Your second video makes it clearly look like the ship hit a shallow area with its keel first and then turned sharply just before it grounded.

It also shows (for the first time) the strong turn to port right after the collision with the rocks. few web sites have shown that before - although it is mentioned in many articles.

The problem with all of the early articles is that they mention an initial list to port (when he hit the rocks) followed by a list to starboard - but NONE of the early article mention the two events are 40 minutes apart. You got the impression they followed one another immediately by most passenger accounts as written in articles.
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  #278 (permalink)  
Old January 25th, 2012, 12:14 PM
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Originally Posted by felix_the_cat View Post
No, they didn't. That has been offered to all who are booked on Concordia til the end of March. Costa has offered full refunds on any of their ships that are booked for those who have decided they don't want to cruise at this time. They have until February 7th to decide.

Costa has been back peddling on a lot of the help or lack thereof over the last couple of days. However, they did not offer 30% discount to those involved, only to those on future sailings.
thank you. As one of the few of my friends who love cruising ... i'm seeing a lot of anti-cruise postings especially bashing costa. Not that I want to come to their defense or anything .... but its just nice to get the facts.
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  #279 (permalink)  
Old January 25th, 2012, 04:33 PM
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Originally Posted by felix_the_cat View Post
No, they didn't. That has been offered to all who are booked on Concordia til the end of March. Costa has offered full refunds on any of their ships that are booked for those who have decided they don't want to cruise at this time. They have until February 7th to decide.

Costa has been back peddling on a lot of the help or lack thereof over the last couple of days. However, they did not offer 30% discount to those involved, only to those on future sailings.
A message I got from my travel agent, who claimed to be relaying a message from Costa, was posted in Costa offer to Concordia passengers

There were three options:
1: ticket refund + 30% off a future cruise
2: ticket refund + free cruise before 31 March
3: ticket refund
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  #280 (permalink)  
Old January 25th, 2012, 06:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arion View Post
A message I got from my travel agent, who claimed to be relaying a message from Costa, was posted in Costa offer to Concordia passengers

There were three options:
1: ticket refund + 30% off a future cruise
2: ticket refund + free cruise before 31 March
3: ticket refund
Yes, that's true - but not for the passengers of the ill-fated cruise but for all others.
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  #281 (permalink)  
Old January 25th, 2012, 06:59 PM
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Originally Posted by felix_the_cat View Post
Yes, that's true - but not for the passengers of the ill-fated cruise but for all others.
It does contradict what I've read on Costa's website since ( which I didn't know when responding earlier ). It was however what my travel agent sent me. I was on the ship having boarded that day in Civitaveccia.
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  #282 (permalink)  
Old January 26th, 2012, 10:00 AM
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It does contradict what I've read on Costa's website since ( which I didn't know when responding earlier ). It was however what my travel agent sent me. I was on the ship having boarded that day in Civitaveccia.

Oh I am so sorry you had to go through that. I'm sure you would know better than any of us.

My only point (because I am a TA) is based on the info I received directly from Costa, that is not the offer they made to those on that cruise but I do believe in their hurry to cover their hieny's they have made mistake after mistake and some of the information that has been released was done without thought.

As bad as this was and is, the press just has to make it even more so. That's what they do best. Truth doesn't count unless it makes a story.
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  #283 (permalink)  
Old January 27th, 2012, 09:45 AM
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So, the offer is $14,460 per person for those not injured on the Concordia and that doesn't include any crew. That isn't going to fly. Too many lawyers and consumer groups are now involved.

Over 3,000 passengers have apparently already signed on to the various class action lawsuits and the Italian consumer groups/lawyers have signed on with at least two class actions that have been filed in the States.

I guess the opening salvo has now been played.
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  #284 (permalink)  
Old January 28th, 2012, 09:13 PM
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Numbers pile up total of one class action suit is now $450,000,000. That would mean the lawyers would reap approx $150,000,000.
But that kind of cash outlay would bankrupt the company.
On another note, tired of the press making dire predictions about the world is going to end bacause of the bunker oil on the ship. I understand the removal process begins tomorrow or Monday. They will pump sea water into the tanks to keep the ship 'balance'.....The company hired to pump the tanks knows what they are doing. Dear Press...stop speculating, report facts. if you cannot do that then shut up.
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  #285 (permalink)  
Old January 28th, 2012, 10:02 PM
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Numbers pile up total of one class action suit is now $450,000,000. That would mean the lawyers would reap approx $150,000,000.
But that kind of cash outlay would bankrupt the company.
Lloyds of London will be paying the cost. Costa will not bankrupt. Carnival Plc Corp will have to pay some $$ but not to the level of bankruptcy.
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  #286 (permalink)  
Old January 28th, 2012, 11:04 PM
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Originally Posted by felix_the_cat View Post
So, the offer is $14,460 per person for those not injured on the Concordia and that doesn't include any crew. That isn't going to fly. Too many lawyers and consumer groups are now involved.

Over 3,000 passengers have apparently already signed on to the various class action lawsuits and the Italian consumer groups/lawyers have signed on with at least two class actions that have been filed in the States.

I guess the opening salvo has now been played.
I think any lawyers thinking they are going to get the case heard in the US is going be disappointed.

The cruise contract dictates that the cruise line decides where any action has to be filed. In this case, Costa is based in Italy.

That portion of the contract, giving the cruise lines the right to choose the location of any action has been upheld by the courts in previous suits.

I think any talk of a 450 Million dollar settlement to the passengers who survived are truely dreaming.

Though whatever the final settlement, combined with the loss of an almost $500 million ship, will make this the most expensive maritime disaster in history.
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  #287 (permalink)  
Old January 28th, 2012, 11:38 PM
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This is a link to the best graphic I have seen that explains what happened to the Costa Concordia.

https://idisk.mac.com/snoozeman//Public/Concordia.pdf

It's a big graphic in pdf format and might take a minute to download.
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  #288 (permalink)  
Old January 29th, 2012, 09:52 AM
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That was interesting! Boy talk about not wanting to admite defeat.Seems to me the Captain had plenty of time to get everyone off the ship in an orderly fashion.
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Old January 29th, 2012, 10:01 AM
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I think any lawyers thinking they are going to get the case heard in the US is going be disappointed.

The cruise contract dictates that the cruise line decides where any action has to be filed. In this case, Costa is based in Italy.

That portion of the contract, giving the cruise lines the right to choose the location of any action has been upheld by the courts in previous suits.

I think any talk of a 450 Million dollar settlement to the passengers who survived are truely dreaming.

Though whatever the final settlement, combined with the loss of an almost $500 million ship, will make this the most expensive maritime disaster in history.
When faced with this firms often just go bankrupt??
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  #290 (permalink)  
Old January 29th, 2012, 12:43 PM
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Its a lot tougher to lose the ship than pay $150-million.

And by the way Carnival Corp earned something like 100 times that amount just in 2011 - 14.4 billion (I heard someplace). Not profit - net revenue.

As said - Lloyds of London will be paying the bill, but insuring ships is going to go up as well.

But is it a new day in the cruise world - only slightly. In a year this will be not forgotten, but also not much of a factor in terms of how well cruises sell.
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Old January 29th, 2012, 12:50 PM
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That was completely wierd. My whole post disappeared.

So, I'll repeat - even if only to myself.

There will be no bankrupcty. Carnival Corp is only on the hook for about $30 Mil. or so. There will be old time cruisers who won't stop cruising. But.....there will be a lot of peope who would have cruised who now won't.

As for suing in the U.S., don't count that out. This is so different than anything that has come before, I just wouldn't count it out.

I believe that the offer on the table now is an insult. Had they started at $25 grand - maybe, but their number crunchers have come up with a number that is a complete insult.

As long as it's kept at the fore-front of the press, the survivors will have a chance of getting it heard in the U.S. Just don't count them out just yet.
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and some unknown tub

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