Carnival **sigh**

[Cruisebunny7]

I don't know why. I don't know how. I don't even know when. But somewhere, for some reason, at some point in time...Carnival changed.

When I first starting sailing Carnival, it was a totally different line than it is today. The Fantasy class ships were the ships to sail. The Atriums still had the beautiful statues, and the environment was fun, carefree, and laid back. Sailaway parties, Glamourous young people, no complaints, no cares.

Carnival did not care to impress outside of thier market. They were doing very well catering to the young, fun crowd. Life was good, ships were FUN and nights were never ending.

Why. Why did they take this away from us? The YOUTH of the cruise industry? Don't the mature cruisers have enough ships to choose from???

For the mature cruiser they could have any of the following lines and then some.

HAL
Princess
Celebrity
Costa
Cunard
RCCL
Crystal
Seabourn
ACCL
Silversea

So why Carnival??

What more do they want to take from us? Why Why Why did they take OUR cruise line away? Why are they SO greedy? We just want ONE cruise line where we can have a good time. Not be bothered by hokey parties, or quiet times???

I WANT MY CARNIVAL BACK.

THINGS WERE MUCH BETTER WHEN IT WAS JUST CARNIVAL. SIMPLY THE FUN SHIPS.

This was a bitter mistake on Carnival's part. Taking them away from the youth. They won't see it now, but they will. The youth are leaving the cruise industry for all-inclusive resorts. Just wait and see.

I personally will not sail on any of Carnival's new ships. I am sticking to the REAL fun ships of Carnival. HOLIDAY, CELEBRATION, FANTASY, ECSTASY, SENSATION, FASINCATION, INSIPIRATION, IMAGINATION, DESTINY, ELATION, PARADISE, TRIUMPH, VICTORY.

[DougR.]

You are not going to like this at all but here goes:

America is aging and along with it the cruising public. The former Carnival party animals are aging as well. Inevitably as one ages one tends to calm down and become more sedate in their tastes and lifestyle (See what you have to look forward to? ) Carnival realizes this and is apparently making changes to continue to attract their core audience, many of whom are now married with children and families. It is a corporate decision based on demographic data.

When I was 20 my idea of a good time was to drink myself into hungover oblivion and ask my friends what happened the next day.

When I was 30 my idea of a good time was to drink to get a good buzz on and dance around with the lampshade on my head.

When I was 40 my idea of good time was to have a couple of social drinks dance and laugh at bad jokes.

Now that I am in my 50s I prefer to have full memory of what transpired the night before and not wonder who it is in bed with me

Seeeeeeeee.. you do have a lot to look forward to!!!!

[dina]

Dougr... LMAO thank you... Its all true..

[ready2gonow]

Doug! You hit the *nail in the head*!

[DavidBgood]

Actually, a_langett makes a good point for two reasons.

"Why. Why did they take this away from us? The YOUTH of the cruise industry? Don't the mature cruisers have enough ships to choose from??? "

IF everyone realised that by going on these ships that it was "PARTY TIME", then everyone would understand expectation of placing yourself in that environment.

Thats great, give a product that suits the people that want to party and for the others "picking a ship or line" with no research, but usually because of the pirce paid and availability...... then do so at your risk. If you dont want to take part, dont go and dont complain.

Great post 8)

Problem is the lines dont pitch it that way now, they give a mixed message regarding what to expect...so who's happy

[Dorothy]

I've gotta say Langett, you're the first person I've ever heard refer to the Carnival crowd (then or now) as "glamorous young people."

Young? Certainly. Glamorous? I guess everybody has different ideas of glamour.

Having just sailed RCI, I find that Carnival still has a lot of party left in her!

dorothy

[IBCRUZIN']

DougR said it perfectly. The "party crowd" of the Carnival of 20 years ago are now in their 40's and 50's. They drink with maturity and party within reason.

No one is going to abandon cruising for all-inclusive land resorts. Land resorts are much more expensive and usually involve an initial investment of a few thousand dollars ($2K-3K) for a 7 night stay. That doesn't include anything you do off of the resort. A cruise requires an investment of less than $1,000 to get you are on the ship and to keep you drinking moderately for the duration.

Cruising has allowed me at least 3 very nice vacations a year. And I book solo cabins. What I am getting for $1200 on the Carnival Liberty next weekend would cost me at least $4,500 for a similar quality all-inclusive land resort for 8 days. I am not spending $4,500 on all three of my 2007 cruises which will span a total of 20 days, spending money included.

Sorry to say but Carnival's core market are just getting older and their tastes are changing accordingly.

[Cruisebunny7]

Thats the point. That is thier major mistake. They are catering to the elder generation. Hear me out. This is what I predict for the future of Carnival.


Carnival now caters to the baby boomer generation. That's fine, that is where all the money is. However, what is going to happen to Carnival when the Baby Boomers can no longer travel? Since they are turning thier back on the American youth they are losing thier future passengers. When the Baby Boomers were young they turned to Carnival because they were the "Party Ships" they were looking for. Hence why the Baby Boomers still cruise. If we learn from history we can begin to see the end of the cruising era. There are plenty of other ways to travel. The X generation is finding alternate means of vacation fun. Take Easy Cruise for example. You pay a minumum price to stay on the ship. You pay extra for food, drinks, even towels onboard. However, the ships overnight in hotspots in Europe so that these young travelers can party the night away and then come back to the ship to sleep soundly to thier next party destination. They are turning the cruise ship into a "hotel ship". I believe this is the dimise of the cruise industry as we know it. Trends like Easy Cruise will catch on with the youth.


This makes me incredibly sad. To know that eventually, cruising will return to the genre it once held. The large ships will be dismantled and sold for scrap, the companies will break apart and then disappear.

So there you are Baby Boomers. Enjoy your cruises...as well as social security. Enjoy these things that are catered to you while not even having a thought for the rest of us. For when this generation is your age, we will no longer have a Carnival or RCCL to turn to.

That is why I will cruise as much as I can now. I know it won't be here for much longer to enjoy.

[Cruisebunny7]

Ohh about the glamourous young people quote.



I think all young people are glamourous. We have our youth, our beauty, our whole lives ahead of us. We are the future of this world as we know it. That in itself is glamourous. Glamour can be more than skin deep. I believe your idea of glamour is one of wealth, sophistication, and beauty. The dictionary describes glamour as "full of excitement, adventure, and unusual activity" hence why the careers of Flight Attendants and Pilots are described as glamourous.


So there you are. The youth or Carnival may not be physically glamourous according to some. But by definition, they most certainly are.

[IBCRUZIN']

Many of tomorrow's adults have been hooked on cruising today by their parents. The young adults today will go for Cruise One for a while but, as they mature and their $$ are expanded, they will want some of the amenities that they remember from their childhood.

In my opinion Cruise One is a novelty that will eventually wear off. It is fun once, twice but for the long haul, nothing beats the all-inclusiveness of a traditional cruise.

Have no fear, the cruise industry is not going anywhere. It may suffer from various economic ups and downs and maybe even some really bad press but all in all, it is here to stay.

Very few people, even young people want to get on a ship with a bunch of hard core partiers who believe that getting wasted beyond comprehension, stumbling around, throwing up, and just acting like cavepeople are examples of a perfect cruise. The cruiselines don't want to be bothered with that anymore. They no longer have to overlook that behavior.

Unfortunately, you are in a minority even for your age group.

How old are you anyway?

If you are remembering the cruise industry of old, you either were a young child when Carnival was a party hardy cruiseline or you are as old as the rest of Carnival's core market -- baby boomer. If you were a young adult 10, 15 or 20 years ago, what you may be longing for is the nostalgic memories of your carefee youth.

How old are you?

[Cruisebunny7]

I'm not asking the crusing public to get wasted and throw up. You are just ASSUMING that is what I mean. Assumptions always get us into difficult issues.

The Carnival definition I am trying to re-live is the fun Carnival. No "quiet times", No corny games, etc. I am not saying an all out frat party. By any means. I actually do not recall even saying anything of that nature in ANY of my posts....pretty ironic. I am simply saying they are catering to an older crowd. In my opinon that is a mistake. Take it or leave it. My age does not matter. I am old enough to know better. I have cruised Carnival with my parents since the early eighties, and cruised as an adult since 1998.

In fact even my "old" parents won't cruise anymore. The "mature" nature of Carnival's passengers have cast them off of the band wagon. If the cruise industry has become too hokey for my "old folks" than I can't think I am in the wrong.





It's hilerious how things can get twisted in the minds of others.

[colorcrazie]

Sorry, but being young does not mean being right. Being old does not mean being right either. Cruising has become so well established as a great vacation that I doubt it is going anywhere, except to sea. I would suggest that you try going with a singles group. They create their own party atmosphere.
Oh, and it is not just Carnival that changed. When I was young and partied, NCL was my preference.
Marty

[IBCRUZIN']

Originally Posted by a_langett

I'm not asking the crusing public to get wasted and throw up. You are just ASSUMING that is what I mean. Assumptions always get us into difficult issues.

The Carnival definition I am trying to re-live is the fun Carnival. No "quiet times", No corny games, etc. I am not saying an all out frat party. By any means. I actually do not recall even saying anything of that nature in ANY of my posts....pretty ironic. I am simply saying they are catering to an older crowd. In my opinon that is a mistake. Take it or leave it. My age does not matter. I am old enough to know better. I have cruised Carnival with my parents since the early eighties, and cruised as an adult since 1998.

In fact even my "old" parents won't cruise anymore. The "mature" nature of Carnival's passengers have cast them off of the band wagon. If the cruise industry has become too hokey for my "old folks" than I can't think I am in the wrong.

Carnival ships are loaded down with babies, children, tweens, teens, newlyweds, senior trips, college students, young adults. It is the youngest crowd and has the most single party people you will find at sea.

I think your taste in vacation has changed and perhaps you have had one memorable experience on a cruise and you compare all of your cruises to that one.

I have been on Carnival since 1999 and to be honest, the only difference I see is that the food has gotten better. In fact, it is more of a fun atmosphere now than I remember from that first cruise in 1999 on the Fantasy.

If it is not the falling down drunk, everybody's drinking all night long, what exactly is it that is now missing? The dance clubs are still jumping, the piano bar patrons are having a ball, all of the psuedo-singers are in karaoke living it up, the older passengers are doing the tango and lindy hop in the lounge.

The sailaway parties have become less of an event simply b/c most people are still unpacking and are tired from traveling from God knows where to get to the ship. The midnight buffet is no longer a nightly thing b/c the buffet, speciality restaurants and 4 different dinner seatings has all but assured that there are no hungry people on the ship at 11:30 p.m. Also, people now understand and try to moderate their constant eating so no one is looking for another full full meal at midnight. And, who does't already have a zillion pictures of the the gala buffet and all the beautiful food. That is so "been there, done that".

As people cruise more, the rush rush rush to do everything and experience everything is no longer in the air. Many people cruise multiple times a year so there is no need to zoom around 24 hours a day on the ship. They have become quite comfortable and therefore Carnival doesn't have to pump everyone up so much. Most of us know what to expect, what is going to happen, what we like, what we don't and what to avoid or enjoy based on our personal tastes.

From your posts, I get the impression that something personal has happened that has turned you off so completely.

Anyway, by nature that you are on this board, I would dare to bet you will be back on another ship in no time.

P.S. Have you tried Cruise One yet? I am curious about that line.

[sapphyre]

a_lagnett, Hate to tell you, but Gen X are becoming parents (or in some cases, have been for a while), and the last remnants of Gen Y are graduating high school this year. (Generalizations, of course.)

Last time I was on Carnival it was still a huge party, in fact the much older people down the hall bragged that their bar budget was more than twice the cost for them to even get on board. Yes, they did have the corny games, but most of the ship enjoyed them (lubricated by the alcohol). It certainly sounds like you're looking for the free for all frat party. Easy Cruise (or whatever they are called) is about the only place anyone is going to find it on ship.

IB is right, the "young people" will not move to the all inclusive land resorts. The never ending partiers how have more money than sense to know when to pack it in will.

[colorcrazie]

The corny games have always been around...well, maybe not on the Titanic! But definitely since early 1980's.
Bon voyage parties got canned because of ecological concerns. Now, I never really understood how bits of paper mache did all that much damage, but I'm no expert. I do miss those, though. Same reason why no more clay pidgeons.
Marty

[DavidBgood]

a_langett, some if not most are missing it....it being the very well written and placed point. Well done you, some of the best I've seen in a long time.

And I totally agree 8) People are mixing up or forgetting.

As for Stelios and Easycruise, if I was "a wee bit younger". I would jump at something like that and the young crowd will., make no mistake

Why, well for one aas you say they do stop at ports overnight. Two you can get off the ship spend a few days in that port and then rejoin the next Easy Ship to go to the next destination, just like buses or trains but at sea and with a cabin. Now how cool is that.

There is no doubt Carnival started as you stated, so maybe they should take a ship or two out from "mainstream" and make them again the "young peoples" party ship and advertise as such. That way the new young know what to expect and the "other generations" know to stay well clear.

Its perfect and why they have missed that, I have no idea.

Again your right, there is soon to become a very big gap in generations booking cruises, we may actually go full circle and its only the "older generation" doing it.

In my opinion children will cruise with parents until they are X age, so they get to like cruising.

BUT said child will then go away from cruising to "explore" and then MAYBE come back when he or she now has one or two kids of their own and wants to go cruising again. Thats a big gap and a big risk for the lines if they do offer something for the 21 - 32 market, and thats what people like Stelios are trying to take advantage of.... the people of an age and requirement that the big guys are missing.

Again, great post 8)

[IBCRUZIN']

You are right DBG that age group is probably being ignored by the large mega-cruiselines. It is a segment that may need some attention. However, it will have to be by a small cruiseline. Carnival, NCL nor RCCL will not dedicate any of their ships in the hopes that they can fill it 51 weeks out of the year. Why? B/c of several things:

1. 21 - 32 is the leanest years of most people's life.

There is finishing college, grad school, student loans, credit cards obtained while in college, first car notes, first apts, first real job, starting careers/business, courting the opposite sex, expensive weddings, marriage, buying houses, having children. All of that happens during those eleven year for most people. Therefore, this is not a demographic that can be depended upon to go on a major vacation even once every year and certainly not several times a year. They simply do not have the disposable cash for major vacations on a regular basis at this point in their life. (as a generalization) It is a much surer bet to court the 30+ and under 20's. They can always catch up with the 21 - 32 when they turn 33.

2. This demographic is bound to have more people that still believe life is a Frat Party, therefore the upkeep of the ship, repairs, liability, security and general babysitting makes this not a feasible venture for cruiselines with deep deep pockets. Whenever a young (or not so young) person does themselves harm on one of these ships, they think "it is someone else's fault that I am stupid, I am going to sue." No way do any of the mass market or premium market cruiselines want to be bothered.

3. Finally, a cruise line like EasyCruise (I found out the real name) is not really marketed towards the average 21-32 year old in this country. It is actually more patronized by baby boomers, Europeans, and seniors who just have a more carefree, unstructured vacation in mind and have decided to forego the amenities for more island choice and flexibility. A floating Hostel if you will. It is not necessarily a cheaper way to travel and certainly not a safer way for young people to party hardy in a foreign land. It is actually quite dangerous b/c there is no structure and it may be several days before anyone even knows you are missing. Wasn't there a movie about that last year? I think it was called "Hostel" or was it "Touristas"? Same thing actually.

Sure the young party crowd may have started it all but it has caught on to all the other generations and they are the ones with the $$.

[Fruitcake]

My daughters have cruised on Royal Caribbean as teens.
And in 2005 -- both girls in their 20s -- they cruised with me on HAL.
The younger one got married last year and for their honeymoon she and her husband cruised NCL.
She said she preferred HAL.

This fall both girls -- still in their 20s -- will be going on a HAL cruise.

In fact, my younger daughter tells everyone who asks about cruising to try HAL! She's got her brother-in-law, sister-in-law and her husband's parents all sailing on HAL this summer!

My daughters are not on the quiet side at all ... they love a good party. The single one is a bartender at the beach!

But neither is interested in Carnival whatsoever.
[That's purely based on what they hear from their peers.]

So ... go figure.
The younger generation -- some of them -- may be choosing the more "adult" lines.

[Cruisebunny7]

Thanks Dave, I am so glad someone has found the point of my concern. I do think they could spare the Holiday or Celebration for a younger cruise experience. It would definatly bring them money.

[DavidBgood]

a_langett

IBCRUZIN'

Bollocks on point three, you have that line and their market back to front, they are young party ships, and addressing a need not given or provided by or on the big guys today, believe me.

Youngsters with a bit of fun are scared to breath on todays ships incase they upset "someone".

Why, because everything is so grey now, but not so grey that some lines will advertise some very big ships as being "adult only". The problem there is adult goes from 21 -101+ in age and personal enjoyment and expectations in that age range differs greatly.

I have been on ships that the average age was 65-90, so God help some young people looking for fun on these "main stream" ships. As most of the passengers disappear to bed by 9:30pm, and again God help someone making a noise in the corridor after that time

As for the leanest years regarding finance available during those years, I am that sure that for the money you can pick up a cabin and a ship for 5-7 days for around $500 in the bucket shops. So why when such a “cheap� vacation is available, do the "poor" youngsters not go?

In my opinion because there is no real vehicle for them to relax and be themselves and in their own age group, its all grey regarding expectation and a big melting pot and usually middle aged driven.

Okay, when was the last time you went to the “disco� on the ship and how sad did that look?

They would go if they felt there was something in it for them, with people that reflected their age and their comfort zone, knowing people on there are of a similar age and have similar expectations regarding fun and party.

In some ways I think people are expecting people at 25 to act or think like people of 65, that is so wrong, but some young people do that, they become older than they are and fit in with the old crowd straight away, that’s their comfort zone fine, but its not for all.

So the majority of youngsters not attached to Mom and Dads purse strings will not buy a vacation on todays ships as first choice as they dont want to be surrounded by a load of old "fuddy duddies" on that ship.

Hey, I dont think I am, but I am not looking at me through the eyes of someone at 24

And if I get points 1 and 2 right, your saying not to expect people from 21 -32 to cruise for financial reasons. That may be your experience of that age group, not mine.

Maybe at one time that scenario was true, but that age group today in a lot of cases have in my opinion money to burn. They take“years out� and travel the world for God sake before even starting work today…good on them.

But the vacation of "cruising" today does not offer them an environment that suits their age or expectations, so they go land based.

And one last thing, fun and party does not always mean, destruction and vandalism.

Did you act that way at 21-32, I did'nt.

[IBCRUZIN']

By all accounts young people are coming out of college with unbelievable debt. They have been inundated with easy to get credit cards and have almost blank checks when it comes to student loans. Add that to all of the electronic niceties that are absolute necessarities to them, and you got people that are living paycheck to paycheck.

Some young people who do not have those obligations can take a year or two off b4 they get down to business but those are the young who are still being supported by their families, that and the drug dealers. In order to take a year off, they have to have somewhere to get money for food and the most basic necessarities. Most American young people do not have an unending supply of $$. They have to go to work.

I have gone into the dance clubs on several carnival ships and it is akin to any dance club in New York City. They are rocking.

There will never be ships geared to the 21 - 32 age bracket unless they want what can be also offered to older and younger.

Carnival does not rack up $1,000 sail and sign accounts from the young adults. They don't tend to go on the excursions. They don't take many pictures. They don't buy liquor on the ship (they sneak it on -- generalization here). They do not have the gold, silver, platinum and black credit cards with 5 and 6 digit credit lines. There simply is no profit in that age group which is why the shorter, younger crowds take the short cruises and therefore get the older ships.

Fascination is a pure party ship. It does short cruises and the passengers are younger. It is not a drunk ship but more of a party ship. If that is not enough for some people, then cruising is simply no longer for them. May I suggest Cancun. There is nothing to do in Cancun but beach, party and drink.

21-32 does not mean vandalism but a ship with 3,000 25 year olds is more like to suffer from misadventure than a ship with a mix of passengers.

Lastly, yes I have done some things in my pre-32 years that were beyond stupid. Absolutely. More things than I would ever admit.

[colorcrazie]

In spite of my age, I have ended up with a group of friends that includes several in the 21-25 year old range. They don't have money to burn, but they can and do find budget vacations, including cruises. And, while they do love to party, they have no problem with Carnival because they find others who are on their same wave length and make a party. I think that part of it is their proactive approach to life. Probably why we are friends. They don't expect to have things, including a party atmosphere handed to them. They take control of their own lives. And they are open to other ways of having fun. Even conversation!
Marty

[Fruitcake]

Originally Posted by colorcrazie

In spite of my age, I have ended up with a group of friends that includes several in the 21-25 year old range. They don't have money to burn, but they can and do find budget vacations, including cruises. And, while they do love to party, they have no problem with Carnival because they find others who are on their same wave length and make a party. I think that part of it is their proactive approach to life. Probably why we are friends. They don't expect to have things, including a party atmosphere handed to them. They take control of their own lives. And they are open to other ways of having fun. Even conversation!
Marty

You know, that describes my daughters perfectly!
I think that is why they enjoyed HAL so much. They were able to have fun because t hey *made* the fun!

[misguidedangel]

I have to disagree with you for the most part. I was on the Victory--and a beauty of a ship she is--in January and I can say that there was a good mix of all age groups. The lido deck constantly had hot pop/dance music of the day playing--CRAP music I call it--I prefer the music am memories of the 80's to what is out there now--music that wo't be remembered in 5 years (majority of it).

The nightclub was booked for one or two nights for "old timers" private functions because there was a large group of 50+ people who were on a group cruise together.

Carnival has to market itself to the group who can afford to go on cruise vacations. How many 20somethings do you know that can afford one, two, or three cruise vacations a year? Not many. I know what it is like, I had a huge debt load and went 15 years without a vacation because all of my money went to credit cards, rent, loans, utilities, etc. I was fortunate to have a useless member of my family (my father) die last year and left my mom with a confortable income. My mom decided to splurge and treat us to a vacation, which was supposed to be all five of us but worked out being my mother and I only for a cruise and then a few weeks later my brother (wife, niece, and mom) headed to Orlando for 10 days and a 4-day cruise to the Bahamas. We all had a good time and my mom, who is 67, and I are going again next Febraury on the Conquest, four months after I get back from Eastern Caribbean cruise on the Triumph.

Cruising is for everyone. Make your vacation what you want it to be. There will still be fun/juvenile pool games that go on for the 20-40ish crowd. If you like the fantasy class ships, go that way, but they are now doing 3/4/5 day cruises only and the Triumph, Conquest, and SPirit class ships are doing the 6-10 days cruises.

[Seabeacon]

It's all about the money and the "baby boomers" have the money, not the twentysomethings.

[hazelson]

Got to agree - it's all about the money. Nothing against "young people" - I was young myself once lol. But I am sure the staff prefer the "oldies" as well - better tips less mess - or am I just basing this on my own kids reality of life.

We are in our 50's and prefer the Carnival experience - a little more laid back. We don't want to play bridge or nap in the afternoons - but neither do we want to drink all night and miss the next day's fun.

It's all relative.....

ttfn Jennifer

[stac2006]

Originally Posted by a_langett

I don't know why. I don't know how. I don't even know when. But somewhere, for some reason, at some point in time...Carnival changed.

When I first starting sailing Carnival, it was a totally different line than it is today. The Fantasy class ships were the ships to sail. The Atriums still had the beautiful statues, and the environment was fun, carefree, and laid back. Sailaway parties, Glamourous young people, no complaints, no cares.

Carnival did not care to impress outside of thier market. They were doing very well catering to the young, fun crowd. Life was good, ships were FUN and nights were never ending.

Why. Why did they take this away from us? The YOUTH of the cruise industry? Don't the mature cruisers have enough ships to choose from???

For the mature cruiser they could have any of the following lines and then some.

HAL
Princess
Celebrity
Costa
Cunard
RCCL
Crystal
Seabourn
ACCL
Silversea

So why Carnival??

What more do they want to take from us? Why Why Why did they take OUR cruise line away? Why are they SO greedy? We just want ONE cruise line where we can have a good time. Not be bothered by hokey parties, or quiet times???

I WANT MY CARNIVAL BACK.

THINGS WERE MUCH BETTER WHEN IT WAS JUST CARNIVAL. SIMPLY THE FUN SHIPS.

This was a bitter mistake on Carnival's part. Taking them away from the youth. They won't see it now, but they will. The youth are leaving the cruise industry for all-inclusive resorts. Just wait and see.

I personally will not sail on any of Carnival's new ships. I am sticking to the REAL fun ships of Carnival. HOLIDAY, CELEBRATION, FANTASY, ECSTASY, SENSATION, FASINCATION, INSIPIRATION, IMAGINATION, DESTINY, ELATION, PARADISE, TRIUMPH, VICTORY.

I know what you mean. My wife and I began cruising back in 1995 during our honeymoon and Carnival was magic. The Ecstasy was our first cruise and the food and service was excellent. We choose carnival so many times because it had was lively. Now it is a nickel and dime machine looking make every last dime on you. We traveled on the Miracle out of NYC and every thing was different. The food was hit or miss and by 11 pm the ship was quite. Can some one tell me what happened? Did Carnival turn its full attention towards making every single cent and for get about us? My wife and I are older but we do still want to have fun. Not to insult the baby boomer seniors but they did take our cruise line away from us. My wife and I are a long way from collecting social security if is around for us but I doubt it. We want to have fun but Carnival must survive and catering to the baby boomer seniors is their bread and butter.

[colorcrazie]

Every cruise is different. Even when you are talking about the same cruise line, same ship, same itinerary, there will be a different passenger mix on every voyage. I've experienced this before and one trip would be heavy on the party scene and the next time all was quiet as a mouse. So, one cruise reallly does not give a truly accurate picture of trends or cruise line policies.
Marty

[DavidBgood]

Sorry Marty, starting with your post "Every cruise is different"

Well, yes it is, as it’s new to us for that cruise, but in a lot of ways it’s the same. Apart from decor and layout, it’s the same thing repeated again and again.

Now stac2006.... "Not to insult the baby boomer seniors but they did take our cruise line away from us. My wife and I are a long way from collecting social security if is around for us but I doubt it. We want to have fun but Carnival must survive and catering to the baby boomer seniors is their bread and butter".

That’s it, its their bread and butter and the grey effect...they are all the same.

And that’s what they offer across not only the named Carnival line, but also on all the other “old independent" lines that they now own.

So how much imagination does that show from them when making it now all "the same" especially when they own so many once diverse companies, and so many ships and the bulk of the market….. To try and be different on something for the young?

Being so big and with so many lines, and ships under their ownership. it should not be too hard to place ships suited to a potential younger clientele.

And in some ways go back to how they started, and not what they are trying to do today and "please" all ages and expect the same expectations on the ship, and then repeat that "non risk, safe" policy across all of the fleet or lines.

That’s what I mean about grey, it is becoming grey between the bulk lines that they now own. In their bulk, it's now hard to tell one apart from the other.

I cannot think of any other scenario where so many "trapped" people from ages X-Y, are asked to come together for 5 -14 days and it will lead to everyone having a good time, especially the younger crowd.

If anything this thread has proven to me that main stream cruising today is still driven towards the middle aged + bracket and not as sometimes advertised “the vacation for all�. AS it is not by any stretch of the imagination.... when we are all are lumped together with expectations differing before we arrive.

Dont get me wrong if I go on Silversea or Seabourn, then I know exactly what I am going to get. One I payed for it and two I know the type of people too expect and no young fun party person is going to buy into that.

PS

How many realise from the thread starters post realise from below how many of these names that Carnival actually own and run. Maybe I'm out the game but I counted all, less two 8)

HAL
Princess
Celebrity
Costa
Cunard
RCCL
Crystal
Seabourn
ACCL
Silversea

[colorcrazie]

DBG,
When I said every cruise was different, I was not referring to what the cruise lines do, but to the differing group dynamic that happens as a result of passenger mix. Extreme example was a single friend who booked a cruise hoping to meet other young singles. He did...but all of them were gay, as it happened to be a cruise promoted by a large gay/lesbian organization. Fortunately , he had the right attitude and managed to still have a good time, just not at all what he expected.

I do agree that cruises are getting more and more homogenized, or grey. But, all companies cater to the demographic that is most likely to buy their product. I felt that the OP might be taking it a tad personally. Eventually, those who are very young now will become the demographic that has the bucks and the time to cruise. And lots of them are already hooked on cruising.
Marty