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-   -   oosterdam schedule change (http://www.cruisemates.com/forum/holland-america/385787-oosterdam-schedule-change.html)

sylvester.mary November 2nd, 2011 10:48 AM

oosterdam schedule change
 
Just found out Oosterdam will be delayed one day out of San Diego this Saturday. Any idea what standard compensation is? What they're offering doesn't seem adequate.
Anyone else have problems like this?
Mary from Tucson

MercedMike November 2nd, 2011 11:05 AM

Oosterdam delayed
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by sylvester.mary (Post 1399689)
Just found out Oosterdam will be delayed one day out of San Diego this Saturday. Any idea what standard compensation is? What they're offering doesn't seem adequate.
Anyone else have problems like this?
Mary from Tucson

There is NO standard. The cruise line makes what offer it chooses.

What are the circumstances? Will you be able to board the ship and enjoy full use of the facilities? Or will you have to rearrange flights and/or stay in a hotel in San Diego? Makes a big difference.

sylvester.mary November 2nd, 2011 11:23 AM

Oosterdam willleave one day late - Sunday instead of Saturday - and then skip one day in Puerto Vallarta in order to get back to San Diego on the next Saturday.
They are offering a free hotel for Saturday night and $75 to compensate for meals. But we're getting to San Diego at 10 am so we'll be on the hook for lunch, dinner and breakfast - plus no transportation.
Since we're missing one day of crusing, one port day, a million tons of food and entertainment, this just doesn't seem adequate.
And I'd like a little more information on the type of illness that made this necessary.

fun2cruiz November 2nd, 2011 11:35 AM

Well, in reality it is the cruiselines call on what compensation they provide..... the hotel and meal allowance seems reasonable to offset the missed day..... A little OBC would be nice, but I would not count on it.

sylvester.mary November 2nd, 2011 11:49 AM

Just got a HAL call. Nothing new - just an agent trying to figure out how many hotel rooms they need.
Another message board says that there's a regetta this weekend and there are no hotel rooms available. Something similar happened a few years ago and everybody got bussed to Disneyland for the night.
I feel awful for the poor people who got sick on the ship - heart problems, I think. I know the delay is not important versus someone's life. But I don't think HAL is handling this well. (The land people NOT the ship people.)

fun2cruiz November 2nd, 2011 11:55 AM

OK... so it is HAL's problem that a passenger gets ill on a sailing and cauising a delay in arrival ? It's also HALs fault that hotel availability is difficult to find due to an event this weekend ?

I am sure you are upset by this as many others are as well, but to place the blame on HAL due to these unexpected circumstances is just unfair.

Try to make lemonade out of lemons ;)

ruthlessboss November 2nd, 2011 12:06 PM

And if it was YOU who had major problems, would you say, oh, never mind, there's cruisers waiting for the next trip?

fun2cruiz November 2nd, 2011 12:08 PM

The cruiseline is doing the best they can I am sure, to appease the inbound passengers this weekend.....

Ine November 2nd, 2011 01:04 PM

Copied from another cruiseboard:

""For local guests who are not flying into San Diego
To show our appreciation for delaying your clients' arrival until Sunday, they will receive as a goodwill gesture a $150.00 per person Onboard Credit for the first and second guests in each stateroom, as well as a $75.00 credit for the third and fourth stateroom guests.

For guests who are flying into San Diego
If your clients are flying into San Diego and are able to change their flight to arrive on Sunday, we will reimburse for air change fees up to $100 per person. We will also provide a $150.00 per person Onboard Credit as a goodwill gesture.

If your clients cannot change their flights and are arriving on Saturday, we have arranged for a limited number of complimentary hotel rooms in San Diego as well as complimentary shuttle service to the pier on Sunday morning from the hotel. They will also receive a $75.00 per person Onboard Credit to help offset their shoreside meal expenses on Saturday and Sunday morning. If your clients will need hotel accommodations, please contact us as soon as possible at 1-800-577-1728 or 206-626-7395.

Please note that all Onboard Credits can be redeemed to cash at the end of the voyage if not used.

As an additional token of our apologies for this situation, each guest on this sailing will receive a Future Cruise Credit equal to 25% of the base cruise fare paid for the 7-day Mexican Riviera sailing that was originally scheduled to begin on November 5, 2011. Please see the attached Terms and Conditions for full details of our Future Cruise Credit program.""

The ship had to turn back to Hilo with 3 seriously ill passengers.

DeeDee November 3rd, 2011 01:13 AM

"'Since we're missing one day of crusing, one port day, a million tons of food and entertainment, this just doesn't seem adequate.
a million tons of food and entertainment, this just doesn't seem adequate."



Don't you think you are exagerating a bit Mary? How can you miss a "million tons of food and entertainment in one day? :rolleyes:

These things happen and you just have to take it with a grain of salt. Keep calm, enjoy your cruise and don't worry about missing a port. We've missed ports many times - hasn't bothered us one bit. Oh, sure there's always someone *****ing about it, but the majority of the passengers just shrug their shoulders and have a good time.

Cntrygynsd November 3rd, 2011 09:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeeDee (Post 1399827)
"'Since we're missing one day of crusing, one port day, a million tons of food and entertainment, this just doesn't seem adequate.
a million tons of food and entertainment, this just doesn't seem adequate."



Don't you think you are exagerating a bit Mary? How can you miss a "million tons of food and entertainment in one day? :rolleyes:

These things happen and you just have to take it with a grain of salt. Keep calm, enjoy your cruise and don't worry about missing a port. We've missed ports many times - hasn't bothered us one bit. Oh, sure there's always someone *****ing about it, but the majority of the passengers just shrug their shoulders and have a good time.

I suppose if a person (like many here) takes several cruises this is just routine disappointment that goes along with cruising. For some (like us) this is our first. Losing a port day significantly changes the dynamic of your cruise and we are not getting a refund, we are getting more money to spend in less time onboard. This doesn't fix the enjoyment missed in port.

I for one feel very bad for the ill passengers and know that HAL did what they had to do. Is it their fault? No. Should we have to shoulder the burden as unintentional victims of a shortened vacation? Again, no. We saved as much money as everyone else and should be getting the vacation we paid for. We won't. I don't know what the answer is here but for us this will likely be our last cruise if as you say this is routine. Some of us can't shrug it off and take another cruise in six months to make up for it. We won't be able to take advantage of the 25% off the next cruise to be used within 12 months.

Let people be sad that they don't get the fun in the sun they expected. We deserved our fun in the sun, we didn't get it, we will be disappointed. We are allowed to be disappointed, there is no shame in it.

sylvester.mary November 3rd, 2011 10:37 AM

Thank you for expressing so well what I was trying to say.
My heart goes out to the sick passengers and their families - and to the passengers who are going to have problems getting home on Sunday instead of Saturday.
Hopefully, we will all get more information soon.

MercedMike November 3rd, 2011 11:47 AM

Compensation
 
Well, obviously this is circumstances beyond the cruise line's control. When you travel, stuff happens. It is certainly disappointing, but as said above you just have to relax and live with it, and go on and enjoy your cruise.

If you read your cruise ticket carefully you will see that it is so written that the cruise line has essentially NO legal liability.

Nevertheless, it seems to me that the compensation offered is not sufficient. Nothing was said about credit for the missed day cruising? Surely you are entitled to a full cash refund of 1/7 of the cruise fare, to start with!!

If that is done, then the compensation for air rearrangements or the hotel room, plus the OBC, plus the future cruise credit, is a pretty good package. But a night in a hotel and $75 for meals is in no way compensation for a day missed from your cruise, IMHO.

Were the incoming pax a day late in disembarking? I wonder what is being done for them?

Cntrygynsd November 3rd, 2011 11:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sylvester.mary (Post 1399876)
Thank you for expressing so well what I was trying to say.
My heart goes out to the sick passengers and their families - and to the passengers who are going to have problems getting home on Sunday instead of Saturday.
Hopefully, we will all get more information soon.

My pleasure, look forward to seeing you onboard on Sunday!

sylvester.mary November 3rd, 2011 04:32 PM

That's my major question. A night in a hotel does not equal all the service, meals, entertainment and activities of a day cruising. It is not a fair exchange.

sylvester.mary November 3rd, 2011 04:33 PM

It will still be fun - it's just the lack of information and communication that I'm having trouble with.
Thanks, again, for your post.

Cntrygynsd November 4th, 2011 12:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sylvester.mary (Post 1399935)
That's my major question. A night in a hotel does not equal all the service, meals, entertainment and activities of a day cruising. It is not a fair exchange.

I agree, the amount of fun and relaxation that would have come with another day has not been offset by a night's stay in a hotel or some cruise credits. Some will say when coupled with the 25% off it does but ONLY if you are able to book another cruise, which we will think long and hard about. A land based vacation using a daily budget of $371 will buy you a whole lot of fun (based on our total expense for this trip).

At any rate we will have fun! We both discussed and and agreed we will make the most of this situation and have a good vacation. No sense in letting the entire experience be completely ruined.

Bruce Chafkin1 November 4th, 2011 07:32 PM

I have found myself in this situation many times, when my ship was delayed by conditions beyond our control.

You really cannot blame anyone - unless you want to point the finger at the 3 passengers who should have been in a hospital instead of on a cruise to Hawaii.

What is the cruise line required to do for you?
If you read your passage contract, they are required to do nothing.

Right now on Oosterdam, there are over 100 passengers complaining bitterly because they have to spend an extra day - for free - on the cruise. They want compensation.
If they are given compensation, their response will be that it is insultingly inadequate. Will anyone say "Thank you"? No.

The Captain of the ship is currently burning about $100,000 worth of additional fuel to get the ship back to San Diego as soon as possible. His boss will give him plenty of grief for blowing his fuel budget for the year. And his wife will not be to happy that his yearly bonus will be substantially reduced for exceeding the fuel budget.
Will any passengers thank him for that? Not a chance.

The cruise line is paying to re-schedule flights for all affected passengers. They are not required to do this; it is a goodwill gesture only.
Will anyone say "Thank you"? No.

The cruise line is paying for hotels and meals for those passengers who are delayed one day on the next voyage. They are not required to do this; it is a goodwill gesture only. Will anyone say "Thank you"? No.

The cruise line is giving onboard credit to those who are losing a day on the next cruise. The credit can be refunded in cash if desired. They are not required to do this; it is a goodwill gesture only. Will anyone say "Thank you"? No.

After many previous and similar events, the cruise line management knows this:

If they give any amount of compensation, many will complain / claim they are insulted / remove employee tips / threaten to sue / swear they will never sail with the line again. And it costs the cruise line a lot of money. Life will go on and the ships will still be full.

If they do NOT give any compensation, many will complain / claim they are insulted / remove employees tips / threaten to sue / swear they will never sail with the line again. It will cost the cruise line nothing. Life will go on and the ships will still be full.


The cruise line spends a great deal of time, effort, and money to assist it's passengers in cases like this, knowing full well that they will complain and insult just as much as if the cruise line did nothing for them.
Ungrateful is the only word that comes to mind.


Life is NOT what it is supposed to be.
Life IS what it is.
How you deal with that conundrum defines your character in the eyes of others.

fun2cruiz November 4th, 2011 10:13 PM

Well said Bruce.....Bravo !

I have often said that even when some people get something for FREE that they are not entitled to, they still are expecting change !

ruthlessboss November 5th, 2011 05:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bruce Chafkin1 (Post 1400101)
I have found myself in this situation many times, when my ship was delayed by conditions beyond our control.

You really cannot blame anyone - unless you want to point the finger at the 3 passengers who should have been in a hospital instead of on a cruise to Hawaii.

What is the cruise line required to do for you?
If you read your passage contract, they are required to do nothing.

Right now on Oosterdam, there are over 100 passengers complaining bitterly because they have to spend an extra day - for free - on the cruise. They want compensation.
If they are given compensation, their response will be that it is insultingly inadequate. Will anyone say "Thank you"? No.

The Captain of the ship is currently burning about $100,000 worth of additional fuel to get the ship back to San Diego as soon as possible. His boss will give him plenty of grief for blowing his fuel budget for the year. And his wife will not be to happy that his yearly bonus will be substantially reduced for exceeding the fuel budget.
Will any passengers thank him for that? Not a chance.

The cruise line is paying to re-schedule flights for all affected passengers. They are not required to do this; it is a goodwill gesture only.
Will anyone say "Thank you"? No.

The cruise line is paying for hotels and meals for those passengers who are delayed one day on the next voyage. They are not required to do this; it is a goodwill gesture only. Will anyone say "Thank you"? No.

The cruise line is giving onboard credit to those who are losing a day on the next cruise. The credit can be refunded in cash if desired. They are not required to do this; it is a goodwill gesture only. Will anyone say "Thank you"? No.

After many previous and similar events, the cruise line management knows this:

If they give any amount of compensation, many will complain / claim they are insulted / remove employee tips / threaten to sue / swear they will never sail with the line again. And it costs the cruise line a lot of money. Life will go on and the ships will still be full.

If they do NOT give any compensation, many will complain / claim they are insulted / remove employees tips / threaten to sue / swear they will never sail with the line again. It will cost the cruise line nothing. Life will go on and the ships will still be full.


The cruise line spends a great deal of time, effort, and money to assist it's passengers in cases like this, knowing full well that they will complain and insult just as much as if the cruise line did nothing for them.
Ungrateful is the only word that comes to mind.


Life is NOT what it is supposed to be.
Life IS what it is.
How you deal with that conundrum defines your character in the eyes of others.

PERFECTLY said:D

Cntrygynsd November 5th, 2011 11:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bruce Chafkin1 (Post 1400101)
I have found myself in this situation many times, when my ship was delayed by conditions beyond our control.

You really cannot blame anyone - unless you want to point the finger at the 3 passengers who should have been in a hospital instead of on a cruise to Hawaii.

What is the cruise line required to do for you?
If you read your passage contract, they are required to do nothing.

Right now on Oosterdam, there are over 100 passengers complaining bitterly because they have to spend an extra day - for free - on the cruise. They want compensation.
If they are given compensation, their response will be that it is insultingly inadequate. Will anyone say "Thank you"? No.

The Captain of the ship is currently burning about $100,000 worth of additional fuel to get the ship back to San Diego as soon as possible. His boss will give him plenty of grief for blowing his fuel budget for the year. And his wife will not be to happy that his yearly bonus will be substantially reduced for exceeding the fuel budget.
Will any passengers thank him for that? Not a chance.

The cruise line is paying to re-schedule flights for all affected passengers. They are not required to do this; it is a goodwill gesture only.
Will anyone say "Thank you"? No.

The cruise line is paying for hotels and meals for those passengers who are delayed one day on the next voyage. They are not required to do this; it is a goodwill gesture only. Will anyone say "Thank you"? No.

The cruise line is giving onboard credit to those who are losing a day on the next cruise. The credit can be refunded in cash if desired. They are not required to do this; it is a goodwill gesture only. Will anyone say "Thank you"? No.

After many previous and similar events, the cruise line management knows this:

If they give any amount of compensation, many will complain / claim they are insulted / remove employee tips / threaten to sue / swear they will never sail with the line again. And it costs the cruise line a lot of money. Life will go on and the ships will still be full.

If they do NOT give any compensation, many will complain / claim they are insulted / remove employees tips / threaten to sue / swear they will never sail with the line again. It will cost the cruise line nothing. Life will go on and the ships will still be full.


The cruise line spends a great deal of time, effort, and money to assist it's passengers in cases like this, knowing full well that they will complain and insult just as much as if the cruise line did nothing for them.
Ungrateful is the only word that comes to mind.


Life is NOT what it is supposed to be.
Life IS what it is.
How you deal with that conundrum defines your character in the eyes of others.

All good points. Being as it is our first cruise and the first vacation that an entire day was removed from a paid fare it has been a bit of a shock to us both. Perhaps cruising and all it's delays, cancellations and weather related issues just isn't for us. Time and a shortened cruise under our belt will tell. No way to know until we get back whether it was truly worth it. Issues can happen on any vacation, it is worse when it is your first because you just don't have a "good" one to compare to. We'll survive and I'm sure have fun.

Fieldmouse December 9th, 2011 02:38 PM

Bruce: You said everything I would have liked to say only BETTER!

What is it with people now days? No matter what, they just can't be please or satisfied. Is no one willing to bend or be flexible anymore? Perhaps the O.P. is right...if their budget is so tight that the lost of 'one' day cruising spoils a WHOLE vacation..then cruising might not be for them. Like any vacation taken at the same time with hundreds or maybe a couple of thousand people, inconveniences can and often WILL happen. I think HAL is doing as much as they reasonably can to compensate passengers. Is it ideal...no, because the ideal would be to have your one lost 'day'...is the compensation reasonable? Yes.

An alternative: Place all three sick passengers, family members or traveling companions in a medium to large dingy with a couple of the crew, food, water a radio and let them sail out to sea (AWAY from the ship of course)for help. This way NO passengers are inconvenience and wouldn't miss any cruise days. Interested passengers could stand on the deck and wave good-by knowing that care is being sought and they can still enjoy their vacation. After all...."It's not our fault they got sick, why should we suffer."

I'm sure the 3 sick passengers and their families are pretty ticked off that their cruise was cut short too.


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