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  #151 (permalink)  
Old July 6th, 2010, 06:37 PM
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Hi Paul,

I thank you for taking the time to post about the Epic. Although the cabin/bath set up doesn't please me, NCL has a great idea with the studio cabins for solo cruisers. No single suppliment for the studio cabins.

I wish that NCL would reserve a few cabins on all ships, for solos to cruise suppliment free.

I am very happily married, but cruise with girlfriends when DH can't come with me. I would not want to share a cabin with glass bathroom doors with other than my husband. Therefore the Epic would not always be a good choice for me. That said, I will stick to NCL's traditional ships.

Barb
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  #152 (permalink)  
Old July 6th, 2010, 08:17 PM
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Originally Posted by Paul Motter View Post
(let me apologize for my TYPING skills - they are awful - I have to go back and re-edit almost everything I wrote).

I was not a fan of what the reviewers on the first cruises wrote, either.

When I got aboard and started hearing absolutely nothing but complaints from guests about broken showers, TVs, telephones, etc, I could not believe they were on the same ship I was on.

How could they go on that ship and know about all the problems and not report it?

Even on this last weekend one of my media friends had a cabins with NO working telephone and NO working television. She hated it for 2 days, imagine staying in there for a week.

But anyway - I am aware that you liked the ship and disagreed with me about the decor. You liked the decor. I found people who agreed with me, and people agreed with you - so we are neither one right or wrong.

I wanted to like the Cirque show, and I expected to like it. I went into it thinking I would like it but it was my companions who immediately took a disliking to it and asked if Jean Ann Ryan had done it.

It was only after the first 90 minutes of me ignoring their comments and trying to pay attention that I realized I didnt know what I was watching either.

There WAS food for vegetarians, however.

Sometimes shows like this need time. The AquaTheater on Oasis needed about four months before it became an acceptable show, and I heard inside things about that show I never repeated - but I will tell you now the cast almost quit en masse at one point about 10 weeks in.

You said you liked the open floor spaces between decks. (I had said there was only one main atrium point and it was only two deck high) that was technically incorrect, there were other spots where you could see down on decks below. I just didnt feel a cohesive focal interest in what I was seeing between floors. It did not feel like an "atrium" to me. In on spot you were looking down on penny slot machines, in another you were looking down on people eating in a restaurant - why?

One thing a companion of mine pointed I had not noticed - very low ceilings everywhere. Go on Queen Mary or Oasis and look at the high ceilings. Then on Epic even the main theater is but two decks tall. Epic truly has very few BIG rooms. It has a lot of small rooms.

I am wondering if maybe the ship is TOO diverse and segmented. I envision long lines for acts in rooms that are too small. I envision BMG getting burned out doing the same show 4 nights /week, twice each night. On a regular cruise ship they would do it two times total, not eight.

I am starting to wonder if presenting "BIG SHOWS" in a "BIG THEATER" for everyone is not such a bad idea. I think the entertainment on Epic is excellent, I just wonder if THEY can sustain it. There is almost too much entertainment. I know I couldn't see everything I wanted to see.

I have to say Oasis also has excellent entertainment for a cruise ship - but Epic transcends cruise ships. It is proferssional. Oasis has Hairspray and it is the full show, but its a musical, and a safe choice. Blue Man Group is a daring and risky choice that will pay off well.

But in terms of theater size, it is almost like you can see traditional cruise ship style coming full circle - from where it started to Free-style and back again to big theaters - but this time with better shows - Like Blue Man Group, Hair Spray, etc.

The ice shows on Oasis and even Freedom are also truly first class, by the way. Nothing wrong with them.

I also have to say I have not been on Disney but I am willing to bet their shows would also qualify for this elote group.
We can call them atriums or open space - in the end it is semantics. They all have somewhat a chandelier thus I call them atriums.

I am not sure which ships you compare when you talk Epic has low ceilings, RCI has not. As a matter of fact all RCI ships have low ceilings. The only place the ceiling opens up are in atriums or in the Royal Promenade of the Voyager Class, Freedom Class and Oasis Class.

Epic actually holds true in NCL's basic design over the last years by having two decks above each other with several different openings.

Look at the Pearl and I count two or three of these openings with one - I believe - looking at the Le Bistro or some restaurant (got the pics on Facebook).

You speak of the theater as being to small. I think NCL failed to explain their project name F3 which stood for Freestyle 3.0.

The only non-freestyle item on NCL ships was the entertainment such as productions shows having each day two of the same shows at different times. To see any of these shows you were forced into a dinner time which accomadated one of these two show times. The problem with Freestyle dining and fixed shows was:
- If you missed both shows that day you were out of luck.
- To see either show you were pressed into dining times
- dining rooms were packed at the traditional seating hours around 6 pm to catch the late shows and were packed at 8pm after the early shows. Basically like on any other cruise line.

Having shows like BMG perform throughout the week you are not forced into a certain day at a certain time. It eliminates the masses in one huge theater and rather distributes the crowds. Thus the need for only a small theater.

Our TA was a test bunny cruise. NCL took the ship totally incomplete from STX out of necessesity after the 3rd fire.
I talked to the engineers from the company who does the 'fixing' who were onboard and they said that they were about a month away from completition. The chorus was that NCL did the right thing because a longer stay at STX would have been worse. STX France was totally incompetent. The other chorus was: the worst condition a ship could come out of a ship yard. It was so bad STX France couldn't even deliver a spare bearing for the shaft. It was brought in by Meyer Werft in Pappenburg who rightfully so, hopefully, will build NCL's future ships. Without Meyer Werft Epic would still be stuck in Europe.

Anybody booking an inaugural has to expect problems. Period. Oasis had problems and RCI had almost two months after delivery to do shake downs and fix things. You were on the Dec 1 cruise. You remember. It is normal though.

NCL's problems were just doubled because of 'mishaps' by STX France.

One of the problems I see with small theaters is that people think they can't get a seat anymore. If you have a reservation you get a seat. There is no bad seat in the Epic Theater. No obstructions. So, as anxious as people are, they line up 1 hour to two hours before the show. It is just that everlasting "I have to be first attitude".

Even in airports people do that. On my way back at LaGuardia I observed a mother with three teenage children by-pass an entire line just to be first. People do that even if they have assigned seating.

I walked into almost every show with reservations with 10 minutes to spare, maybe 30 minutes. I never had a bad seat.

But what boggles my mind are not so much the criticism of shows or no TV or the likes. What buffles me is the 'experienced' travel writers arguing a point which is no point: the facilities in cabins.

Almost every modern hotel these days has the toilet and sink separated. Not sure where everybody stays but I can throw a dozen new and remodeled hotels in almost every city where toilet and sink are seperated. As a matter of fact I stayed post cruise at the Crowne Plaza and guess what: toilet was single and sink was in room.

And the issue of water spill at the shower? Laughable at best. I really need to edit my movies I made on "how to use the facilities in the new wave staterooms" and put them online.

The new wave staterooms have so much storage space its not even funny anymore. Most went undetected because they are not obvious. Our cabin was not smaller, nor bigger than a regular stateroom. It was simply different aligned and had a different look.

The decor is like food: subjective. Some like it, some don't. I happen to like it. It fits NCL though it is a bit up from their previous designs. The fear everybody had was that it will be packed and a lot of tie ups. Considering that we had a week of bad weather and all the activities were inside and considering we had 3,500 passengers plus 800 passengers from NCL offices we sailed at full capacity, the flow was as good as I ever experienced.

It is weird: about a year and half ago I hailed the Genesis Project and dissed the F3 Project. How the tide has turned.

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  #153 (permalink)  
Old July 6th, 2010, 11:04 PM
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Hi Fl_cruiser. I am glad you are here to share your points of view. I am sure NCL is relieved to know some people did not find problems with the ship.

When I write I often take the viewpoint of Devil's advocate, so do not take everything I say too seriously. But here is what I am starting to notice with Epic Free-style.

It is exactly as advertised, and no one ever said every ship should be the same. The question then becomes "to what kind of people will the new Free-style appeal?"

I envision Epic as becoming a very free-form ship for younger people. I think they will not care about the privacy issue because they are younger and not stodgy like some older people can be.

I think Epic will appeal to groups who want to travel together because the scheduling is very free-form, so there is no obligation to do anything or you miss it.

But by the same token, ironically, the "free-style" actually requires a lot more planning than anyone envisioned, mostly because the venues are smaller than most people realized.

If you do not make your show/dinner reservations early for an Epic cruise (and I mean online well before the sail date) then you will get stuck with show times and dinner conflicts.

Furthrmore, if you miss your showing on Epic for Cirque Dreams, chances are you will not get another chance to see it, because there are not enough showings for everyone. That happened to me. The same is true for Legends at Sea. The same is true for the Murder Mystery. The reason is the small venues. They are built to barely provide one show for everyone onboard at best, and less in some cases.

You wrote: "I am not sure which ships you compare when you talk Epic has low ceilings, RCI has not. As a matter of fact all RCI ships have low ceilings. The only place the ceiling opens up are in atriums or in the Royal Promenade of the Voyager Class, Freedom Class and Oasis Class."

I disagree, all these RCL ships have 3-story dining rooms, main theaters and the Studio B. They have atriums that soar about 10 decks at each end of the Royal Promenade. The RP is three decks on Oasis, 2 decks on the other ships. Oasis has very tall public spaces: the Boardwalk and Central Park. I just get a much grander feeling on the RCL ships.

Queen Mary is the same size as Epic and bigger than Voyager, but holds at least one-third fewer passengers tha Voyager and one half of Epic. That ship has a two-story dining room, two beautiful two-deck ballrooms, a three story main theater. Even Carnival ships which are much smaller have larger public rooms than Epic.

I completely understand the concept of Free-style. It just never occured to me before I went on Epic that making reservations would be a such a big part of the Free-style experience - and good luck if you are on a full ship and want a last minute reservation - you will get dinner at 9:30 or sit in the back row.

So - you have a ship with "wild" spontaneous nightclubs and shows, but the schedule is made for highly organized individuals who are capable of planning their cruise six months in advance. All I am saying is that it didn't occur to me before.

Time will tell - Oasis has tuirned out NOT to have bottlenecks and scheduling issues. But will they be able to say the same for Epic? I am not convinced yet.

I do agree with you about the shipyard. Still, it amazes me that MSC Splendida came out of the same shipyard right on schedule with no flaws that I know of. Was it the shipyard's fault - or did NCL have a personality conflict with the shipyard?

Call me crazy - but having been on NCL I sense there are some people in management there who are a bit "loosey goosey" with professional relationships. They seem to think they can do or say just about anything they want and no one has the right to become offended. That was the impression they left with me, to be honest.

At some point, I predict NCL will have to name a "fall guy" for the failure of the shipyard to deliver the ship in good condition ontime, and when that happens I hope we will learn more about who was really at fault, the shipyard, or undue pressure from NCL that stretched the shipyard as far as it could go.

I got to know Roberto Martinoli very well on the trip - he was hired from Carnival just over a year ago. Roberto's specialty is shipyards. He started in the business because his grandfather was a principle in the Trieste shipyard that is now Fincantieri, where Queen Elizabeth is being built.

This ship started out bad with STX because it was originally a two-ship order, but one was canceled. As I recall there was a hefty cancellation fee. Did that spark some bad blood between NCL and STX?

If the shipyard is at fault where are the lawsuits? Why was there no penalty for delivering a faulty ship?

Or did NCL run out of money and decide it was better to take the ship as is and start generating revenue ASAP?

Speaking to Roberto, he was never one to blame the shipyard. He blamed the first fire as a major setback, but he never said the shipyard was at fault that I recall. Perhaps he was just being careful, though.
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  #154 (permalink)  
Old July 6th, 2010, 11:15 PM
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Barb...

I agree. NCL could make a reputation for itself as the cruise line for singles cruisers. I truly have to give all the credit for this to NCL.

But I almost guarantee you that now that other cruise lines see it working they will be "borrowing" the idea soon enough. I predict a big increase in solo cruising over the next few years.

The trick, by the way, is not just the studio staterooms, it is the LOUNGE where they meet. It is having a special place for singles to congregate with an incentive for them to go there (food, drink, games, a lovely hostess).

The studio staterooms were just cabins before the Lounge was fully developed about day 4 - then the solo crowd came to life. Organization is the trick and any ship can do it if they want to.
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  #155 (permalink)  
Old July 7th, 2010, 01:32 PM
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Hey,
I like you. I am glad we met. Though I disagree on your shower/toilet review I read the other day.

You should not forget that all the entertainment was more limited than it would be on any other cruise.

I.e. I think BMG had only 4 or 5 performances. On their regular sailings BMG will perform 8 times in one week.

Cirque Dreams was only available for 3 nights (twice a night). On regular sailings Cirque Dreams will be available 6 nights for a total of 12 showings.

Legends in Concert was only available twice in the theater and with 3 additional times 'unplugged' in the Manhattan Dining room. On regular sailings this show will be available 12 times in the theater.

The theater holds some 700 people. That's room for 8400 people in 12 shows.

Second City will be available for a total of 12 times on a regular cruise.

Just with any other reservation venue on any cruise line you will be able to book some online. Those may be sold out but the larger quantity will be available on the ship. If people know what they are booking and are somewhat informed and not stand in line and have the rep at the box office explain every show in detail before making a decision there should be very little problem making onboard reservations. I was even able to flip flop reservations onboard including Cirque Dreams - and that was with a limited and reduced show schedule.

I think a lot of times you do not need any reservations for any restaurant. Those places were available throughout the cruise with only minor closed reservation times.

The only reservations I made was Cirque Dreams, BMG, 2nd City and Moderno and Teppanyaki. The only reason I made these reservations was that I knew that Cirque Dreams and BMG will run less than on any other sailing. It was widely known that NCL's first cruise will be very limited in offerings.

The restaurants I only did because I didn't know how big the venue is. Now, with one cruise on Epic under my belt I know I do not need to make all these reservations in advance. The rest of the week we lived Freestyle, walking in and out of dinning venues and shows.

Epic will be exactly as advertised: total Freestyle. The only problem will be the anxiety of people being scared not to get a seat.

Freestyle is certainly not for everybody. Part of Freestyle is that if you want to eat at a certain time in a certain restaurant without reservation you may have to have dinner 30 minutes later or in a different venue for that night. Standing there and whining that the restaurant is full at that time won't help. A really good guide are the dinning monitors showing you the capacity of every restaurant at any given time. Freestyle means being flexible.

Bottlenecks? You are forgetting we were sailing at 4,300 people which is max at double occupancy. Add to it all the workers fixing the ship I would say were were pretty darn full.

Now you throw in that pretty much ALL the activities were inside because of the weather I think NCL not only proved themselves to be flexible in scheduling but it also proves that EPIC will experience very few bottle neck areas.

Epic will attract the next generation, people like me and the high income people who do not like regimentation. Between single occupancy in the Studios and the Court Yard Villas (with the best suite amenities of any mass market line) Epic has to offer something for everybody. I have yet to plan months ahead for any of my NCL cruises. Why would I? Otherwise it won't be Freestyle. But I am highly flexible. If I can't get into Cagney's at a certain day and time I shrug with my shoulders and either pick a different time or go somewhere else. I have enough regimentation in my life (business). Why would I put myself in that position on a cruise line which does Freestyle?


I wasn't talking about venues when speaking of low ceilings. We were talking about the two main decks with the 4 openings. So my comment was a reflection of public spaces outside the Royal Promenade like the Casino and any other hallways outside RP. If you go outside the Royal Promenade on a Voyager Class or Freedom Class ship (like the casino or regular bars) you have low ceilings in every public corridor. To be exact: every corridor is one deck high.

I am not even approaching Oasis and the board walk or central park. Sure it is wide open to the top. But you walk like you walk in the middle of Manhattan. It is really a matter of taste and what you think is 'tight'.
Plus Oasis is 70k GTR bigger. Just for comparison: The Majesty of the Seas, The Imagination and the Norwegian Sky are all around 70k GTR.

I certainly felt more comfortable on Epic from the get-go than on Oasis.


I am sure that NCL people won't say anything bad about STX France. It is just bad business and could lead to lawsuits for damage reputation. NCL also never blamed STX for the problems on the ship. They just took the whining and complaints from the passengers and try to do the best.

The company who was working on the ship though was much more open. They also worked on other cruise lines and new builds from different ship yards. I believe they are one of the biggest. They don't have an allegiance to one or another cruise line or ship yard and are above the politics between cruise line and ship yard.
I'll take their opinion for what it is.

Pressure? What pressure? Epic was supposed to be delivered on June 15. 3 fires (which is almost unheard of) and a busted bearing later pretty much puts the writing on the wall. I could care less if STX was pissy about the cancelled second F3. NCL, as far as I know, paid a couple hundred million dollars in penalties, and that's the end of that. If STX is holding a grudge it certainly is bad business to show it through a lack of security/workmanship.

Epic will be a kicker in the Caribbean. A winner. Did you see all the sun deck space? Holly smokes.
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  #156 (permalink)  
Old July 7th, 2010, 03:39 PM
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It’s hard to believe we saw the same show on board the Norwegian Epic. “Cirque Dreams & Dinner” is one of the most creative and entertaining original pieces of theatre I have ever experienced. The 2 hours flew by and my group of 8 ranging in ages from 8 to 70 were all amazed at what we saw. The costumes, performers and show content were engaging and the quality of a top notch Broadway production. I’m not sure what show you and your friends saw, but maybe all the free booze during the inaugural festivities affected your judgment.
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Old July 7th, 2010, 04:18 PM
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I usually do not chime in on blogs but sorry…I have to disagree with you on Cirque Dreams & Dinner. I attended the Saturday, July 3rd 5:30pm show and was nothing short of amazed. Everyone around me seemed to share the same sentiments. After the show we spoke with others who attended from cruise incentive charter companies to investment bankers and everyone agreed this show was one of the best we had all seen either on land or sea. We also ate at Cagney's Steakhouse and that superb dinner lasted almost 2 ½ hours…very typical of a dining experience. As for Blue Man Group, it was good but we left the show early as that experience was more the traditional, sit in a theatre, cruise ship experience. I would think as the cruise industry attempts to evolve, so would its entertainment. I suggest those reading your blog keep an open mind.
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Old July 7th, 2010, 05:50 PM
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I think the last 2 posters comments are very typical of what happens on a cruise. In the dining venues, entertainment options, even down to service issues....people experience things differently....you could be chatting with anyone onboard about an situation you had, and the person listening to you, could think you absurd, as they had a totally different experience. It has happened to me, many times, as I am sure it has to all cruisers.

Personally, I like to hear, the good the bad and the ugly, and decide for myself....Now BMG is on my hubbys list, I can bet Cirque won't be...we shall see in October, how we compare
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Old July 7th, 2010, 09:43 PM
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Post RE: Cirque Dreams and Dinner

I am really surprised the reviewer on this site has such negative comments to say about "Cirque Dreams and Dinner." I thought the show was great fun and very unique. You can literally see every sequin on each costume, every expression on performers' faces and, while I always knew dancers and performers must be very strong to do what they do, it was amazing to be able to see their musculature up close and personal--they are true athletes!

I was scheduled to see the Friday, 5:30 show during the NYC inaugural and really enjoyed it! There was a great energy and the audience really seemed to have fun as well. As luck would have it, an acquaintance was running late at dinner, so let me use his reservation for the Saturday, 8:00 show. Both shows were excellent, but the second show had several obviously drunk, disrespectful patrons (the price of a free booze/free everything cruise, I suppose) and I cannot help but think that must have been unsettling to the performers, who literally perform within inches of the theatre patrons. One can only hope that the classiness, respectfulness and sobriety of audience members will improve, once the cruise and drinks are not comped. Perhaps the reviewer saw the same 8:00 show I did and was distracted by the disrespectfulness of the audience?

Also, I have to wonder, if some of the people commenting on here have ever been to a dinner theatre? With over 20 restaurants on the ship, why would a large party, hungry for conversation, go to a show to talk? An interactive show like this obviously requires some concentration, some respectful involvement, otherwise the "story" is lost. And, with the performers performing practically in the laps of the audience, maybe it's best not to make the "negative comments" within earshot of the performers? Again, a courtesy I suspect paying audiences will observe, to the appreciation of all.

Another thing I just have to mention--I realize this is just an informal little hobby to most on here, but it seems a bit unseemly for certain bloggers to represent themselves as experienced cruisers, but to then use the heresay of others to support his or her "opinion." Just a thought...

I personally found the show very clever and my friends and I laughed throughout the show. The worst part, as I mentioned, was the discomfort resulting from disrespectful and obviously drunk people that seemed to be at the second show.
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Old July 8th, 2010, 12:13 PM
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I am so glad someone else chimed in with my similar sentiments. We observed some patrons from our table in the back, sitting ringside that seemed to be at the Cirque Dreams and Dinner show for all the wrong reasons. Our group even suspected that they must be from another cruise line checking out the show as they seemed disinterested from the onset. Even if this show was not your cup of tea, how could you over look the amazing talent and costumes? I still can’t stop thinking about how wonderful the show was and would highly recommend it to anyone. I also just found a review from USA Today that said “the show is among the best if not the best we have seen at sea."
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Old July 8th, 2010, 06:49 PM
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Paul,
Thank you for the review.
I have read a lot about the Epic.
This review clearly stands out: professional vision, objective, honest, live.
Although I cannot agree with everything entirely (that is normal:-)), this report is still the best I've seen in the net.
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Old July 8th, 2010, 08:50 PM
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Thank you. I want to point out my first article about Curque Drerams and Dinner written after we saw the preview show in Pompano...

Norwegian Epic's Cirque Dreams and Dinner by Paul Motter
Norwegian Epic promises to deliver the first successful "Cirque" show at sea. A thorough preview with dozens of pictures and video.</SPAN>
03-24-10


But for those of you expressing "shock" thgat anyone would say anything bad aboput the show, I am being full honest as you will see if you read the article above - that I went in expecting to really enjoy this show, and I thought I was enjoying it for the first hour or so, but then I realized that there were too many distractions to a good parts of the show I had seen before.

I enjoyed the acrobatic parts, but the dialog just didn't work for me, and for at least four other, independent people who were not sitting with us all came out immediately after the show and said the same thing - that they really didn't like it.

I also suspect any time I see first-time or one-time posters in a message board coming in a few days after something is posted and giving a different opinion. But that's all I will say.

I am just repeating what I heard from my fellow reporters, and that is indisputable - sorry.

I have video of the show I shot surreptiously that shows the "cupid" balancing act (sort of a harpo Marx impression). You can see he is wearing a safety wire (he is only about 6 feet in the air), his chairs have pre-cut holes for the legs of the other chairs he is "balancing upon" to fit into, and when he tries to shoot his arrow the bow misfires and his arrow just flitters to the floor and he just shrugs like it was part of the show.

Here is a review from a different show from the one we saw: NORWEGIAN EPICawning Of A New NORWEGIAN Epoch | MaritimeMatters | Cruise ship news and ocean liner history

It isn't all negative, but mentions some offensive stereotypes. I heard from a friends that she found some of the jewish and gay jokes to be offensive, especially with kids around. I honestly don't know what she heard, I just know what she said.

I don't think the show was all bad - But I am more forgiving than other people I met. I only believe it needs to be reworked a little.

The scarf and rope aerobatics are very good. The Russian strong men are great (too bad my friends walked out before they came on, about 2 hours into the show).

As I said before - if the show was more action and less dialogue, like our preview, I think it would be more successful.
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Old July 8th, 2010, 08:53 PM
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Fl_cruiser

I just didn't think Legends unplugged worked - at all. I thought it diminished what they showed us in the main theater. So, for me those shows don't "count" that means there are only six shows of Legends at Sea that I felt were worthwhile - but that should reach 3900 people - almost enough for the entire ship.

The cirque show, even if it is shown 12 times per cruise, is still not enough for everyone to see it - but it is close, about 3600.

The line says Epic holds 4600 full - my guess is that it is higher.
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Old July 8th, 2010, 11:58 PM
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Thanks again for your Epic review.

I found another review and the opinion wasn't that favourable for Cirque Dreams either:

A Review of NCL's Norwegian Epic: A Flawed Giant with Va-Va-Voom
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Old July 9th, 2010, 12:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FL_Cruiser64 View Post

Epic will be exactly as advertised: total Freestyle. The only problem will be the anxiety of people being scared not to get a seat.
1. Many venues require extra charge. So that is not "free" from that point, it's a "feestyle".
2. Strict mandatory planning of what you want to see and where you want to eat 45 (!) days in advance is not a free style.
3. Even if you plan everything cleverly (evenings, port days, sea days), it's still a matter of luck whether you get it or not because others may plan same things at the same time.
4. Too many people are onboard. It means competition and long lines.
I think this is “a_peak” of freestyle, I mean the end.
5. Non-“freestyle” ships? Look at Princess: any time dining, 3 main dining rooms, a bunch of other eateries. Eat where you want and when you want. Who can say it’s not a “freestyle"?


Quote:
Epic will attract the next generation, people like me and the high income people who do not like regimentation.
If not washing hands after toilet is a signature of "the next generation", I would rather go back to old fashioned "regimentation".
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Old July 9th, 2010, 09:36 AM
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This requirement alone, Cirque, is a deal breaker...

There will be no bathroom breaks; audience members/diners are required to stay in their seats for the entire two-hour performance......
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Old July 9th, 2010, 03:34 PM
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any male over 50 is going to have trouble at that show
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Old July 9th, 2010, 11:17 PM
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Default Cirque Cont'd

I'm not sure what was being implied by the comment about being suspicious about people's first post on here, but I assure you, I am not employed by NCL or Cirque. Anyway, such negativity...here is a link to a critic who decided NOT to see the show...be sure to read the comments of people who responded to him...proof that everything is subjective (you'll notice some of them have over a thousand posts, if that makes anyone feel better ). The link also contains actual documentation of people's comments and "opinions," not heresay like "everybody said."

Thanks for listening. :-)

**edited to remove commercial link***

Last edited by Kuki; July 9th, 2010 at 11:46 PM.
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Old July 10th, 2010, 08:18 AM
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Default Re: Cirque

Oh, they removed the link I provided on my last post, so I guess they do not allow links on here that provide positive reviews of a show or a cruiseline? How interesting...well, the information can be found on the *edited for commercial link* site. Basically, the reviewer decided NOT to see the show and about 20 or 30 people regulars (some with over 1000 prior posts) responded with feedback telling him what a mistake he had made, how great the show was and why. Many people posted intelligent questions about the show, which were then answered by people who had seen it. Some reviews were mixed, but most were very favorable and positive. Again, everything is subjective. I just do not like to see something unfairly misrepresented.

Thank you,

Graham
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Old July 10th, 2010, 09:21 AM
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Quote:
Oh, they removed the link I provided on my last post, so I guess they do not allow links on here that provide positive reviews of a show or a cruiseline?
People are allowed to post any opinions... positive or negative... what is not allowed is to post links promoting other commercial web sites.

The key word being ""commercial". CruiseMates is a business, and as such we don't allow advertising other sites. You won't see any signs in McDonalds saying Eat at Wendy's

I did take a look at the link, and it's now written by a "critic" or a "reviewer". It's expressing personal opinions..... and that is certainly allowed here as well.
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Old July 10th, 2010, 10:01 AM
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>>you can be pretty sure Queen Mary will be waving at us as they pass us by.
She did, see foto
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Old July 10th, 2010, 10:23 AM
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>>Curque Drerams and Dinner
Hi Paul,

I must agree with the most of your points.
But I"ve noticed nothing about "sisters there

As I expected they were beatifull.
I did not care what they did but I care a lot how they did what they did.

I am sure they get a years hard work to get what they show -
in this very very nice art. And I am not a Circus or Gym fan - it looks
too boring for me .

But I like these girs so much - the presentation art was incredible.


My only problem was that I can not see them on ship anywere (e.g. in Disco).

And I would like to see that show once more time, so as for me
Curque Dreams and Dinner was the best what I got on bord.


OK - I like only Curque Dreams but not Dinner , because I was so full
and I don"t like to eat on show any meal (though it looked very good)
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Old July 10th, 2010, 01:53 PM
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Grandma....

What I reported was a number of opinions spoken to me personally by several NY cruise writers. I believe these people know entertainment on cruise ships and Broadway. If you think any negative opinion is an "unfair misrepresentation" then I suppose you don't tolerate any difference of opinion from your own.


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Old July 10th, 2010, 01:57 PM
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Serge...

I love the Queen Mary Picture - what day was it - 7?

I am very sorry we did not meet up during the cruise. I did manage to connect with a few other people who called or emailed me during the trip.

Sorry, but hanging out in Bliss after 11:00 was just not what I do. I stayed up for some Second City shows but that is the limit of my nighttime fun.
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Old July 10th, 2010, 02:02 PM
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Quote:
This requirement alone, Cirque, is a deal breaker...

There will be no bathroom breaks; audience members/diners are required to stay in their seats for the entire two-hour performance......
Linda... we saw that disclaimer, too, and it is probably there because the actors and waiters use the main passageway all the time.

However, I assure you that if you had to get up and run out the door for a bathroom break no one was going to stop you. Don't let that be a deal breaker.

(I suspect that is just a CYA clause in case someone gets hurt on the way out - which if you are being reasonably carefully is very unlikely).
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Old July 10th, 2010, 08:35 PM
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Paul, glad to hear that, if Bruce decides he doesn't want to see it, I may go with some Cruisemates...we shall see.
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Old July 11th, 2010, 02:51 PM
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Angry No Libraryon NCL Epic

Paul
You didn't mention that NCL decided not to bother with a library on the Epic, just 700 books (for 4000+ passengers) in a meeting room only available when that room isn't being used. The huge library on the Jewel class ships was a major draw for me and the lack of any library on the Epic is totally not acceptable and very, very insulting! Given the current airline luggage costs carrying a vacation load of books is just not affordable. I have serious doubts about both NCL (despite 7 highly enjoyable previous trips) and the Epic. I am also disappointed that you ignored this as well.
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Old July 11th, 2010, 04:32 PM
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Bkarrin I am an avid reader as well, and honestly, I can count on one hand, the times that I have used the library...I never rely on a ship to have the type of books, I want to read, when I want them. I carry my reading in my carry on, and I so enjoy gathering my *cruise* books. After my last cruise, I gor a Kindle, so that's another way I can enjoy reading.

With all that said, that is just me, and I know many, many, people do enjoy using the library. The fact that one was made smaller, may have come about by the realization to the line, that it was not getting used any more the way it used to, and to make it smaller, made sense fiscally,and to use the space in a smarter way, at least to them..I do agree that the availability to users is an issue. I wouldnd't like that either.

I know, libraries are loaning Kindles now, so,you may want to see if this is available in your area. If reading in the library is something you enjoy, and if you are on a ship, that has a smaller one, investigating some nooks and crannies, you may find yourself a hidden jewel! BTW, we have a list of mysteries set on ships, if you are interested
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Old July 12th, 2010, 06:29 PM
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You are right that I did not mention the fact that they do not have a library. The reason is because I am truly NOT that familiar with newer NCL ships only having been on a short cruise on the Pearl and the Pride of Aloha.

I did not realize their older ships have them.

I did hear some of my fellow solo cruisers complaining about the lack of books. I remember Anne Campbell went looking to buy a book because her television was not working, and she came back and said "all they have are bodice-rippers. They all have Favio on the cover!"

Yes, you are right that this is an issue - but not that unusual on mass market ships these days. I don't recall a library on Oasis or Carnival Dream, either.

The truth is they want you out of the cabin spending money - not in the cabin reading and ordering room service. And let's be honest, if everyone stayed in their cabins ordering room service instead of getting out - we'd all be paying much higher cruise fares.
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Old July 12th, 2010, 08:17 PM
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In general, I'm like Trip. I bring my own reading material. However, on one of our cruise's on the Island Princess I found 3 "new to me" books by one of my favorite author's in the library!

I think it's just luck if you can find books you like in the ship's library.
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