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  #1 (permalink)  
Old May 17th, 2013, 08:08 PM
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Default Collision course: US and Russia

Read in a newspaper this morning a story about how the US military forces are able to knock out Syrian air protection units using cyber electronics. The Israelis have used the system prior to an attack on a suspected Syrian atomic power plant site. It can knock out the antiaircraft systems without risking a single pilot sounds like something that might appeal to the administration when its combined with drone attacks. (Sounds like pr build up for the Iraq War.}

So on the evening news I see that the Russians are continutng to deliver the antiaircraft system to the Syrian administration despite Secretary Kerry's pleas not to deliver the missiles. . Plus the other big story in the newspaper today is that the Russians are sending ships to their port in Syria. It's the only military base that they have in the world outside of Russia. Who knew that the Russians have a base in Syria. I didn't know this but I also understand their reason to keep good relations with the president of Syria.

Wow looks like muscle flexing on the part of two super powers that could result in another Afghan or Iraq mess triggered by some incident. It almost happened during the Iraq war when Hussein started launching missiles against Israel with the hope of dragging other Arab nations into the war. The Israelis retaliated, but the US stopped them. Could this occur again If Israel attacks Syria again with the pretext of knocking out a chemical weapon plant. What is the probable outcome? Especially since the Russians are supplying Syria with ground to ground missiles that can be used to hit strategic targets.
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Old May 17th, 2013, 08:50 PM
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Don't worry about it.

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Old May 18th, 2013, 09:45 AM
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We are not sitting on a beach somewhere, so we are a little worried. The US military is worn out with all the wars, and are at a all time low in moral, so we hope that things can be worked out without us.

I call what is going on, just bigger babies, playing with their grown up toys, involving people, who just want to live their lives.
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Old May 18th, 2013, 06:06 PM
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Originally Posted by Luanne Russo View Post
We are not sitting on a beach somewhere, so we are a little worried. The US military is worn out with all the wars, and are at a all time low in moral, so we hope that things can be worked out without us.

I call what is going on, just bigger babies, playing with their grown up toys, involving people, who just want to live their lives.
I am troubled that there are people in this world who just sit around on the computer and make what they think are clever comments or parodies of songs like "Don't worry be happy."

There are people in this country who don't have any skins in the game, and when I say skins I'm talking about children or family members who may have to fight and die or come back from these little wars crippled. No they don't have to worry. They have nothing to lose or risk.

They don't remember that the peace activists protests during the Vietnam War made President Johnson throw in the towel. Those people made a difference they did not sit back and not worry. They were activists and that is what is needed now more politically active people of all political stripes.
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Old May 18th, 2013, 09:06 PM
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There are people in this country who don't have any skins in the game, and when I say skins I'm talking about children or family members who may have to fight and die or come back from these little wars crippled. No they don't have to worry. They have nothing to lose or risk.

.
I have scars myself. I am collecting a disability payment from issues that I picked up in Vietnam.
But I don't worry about the US getting into a war with Russia. Both countries have thousands of nuclear weapons ant the leaders of those countries don't want to die.
It's easy to send a few thousand people into a small country but against Russia it is not going to happen.

So I don't have to worry. You all can worry for me, because none of you were worried when I was under fire in the Southeast Asian war games.

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Old May 19th, 2013, 07:39 AM
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So I don't have to worry. You all can worry for me, because none of you were worried when I was under fire in the Southeast Asian war games.

This is a very sad statement. There were many people worried about you and your fellow servicemen.
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Old May 21st, 2013, 11:29 AM
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Default Vietnam was a stuid war, the Iraq war was a stupid war, Afghanistan is a stupid war

Soldiers who fought in these wars have been well taken care of by the goverment of the USA. The soldiers are getting medical care and pensions. That is not themain point these stupid wars didn't accomplish anything. That's why concerned persons worry about a President and a military-industrial complex that would be willing to put the country's men and women at risk without good reason which has been evidenced by the results of thes stupid wars. Thank God for the peace activists protests during the Vietnam War they made President Johnson throw in the towel. Those peace activists saved many American lives. If the USA had more politically active people of all political stripes, and not people sitting around saying don't worry, be happy: the USA wouldn't be involved in these stupid wars.
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Old May 21st, 2013, 05:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Luanne Russo View Post
So I don't have to worry. You all can worry for me, because none of you were worried when I was under fire in the Southeast Asian war games.

This is a very sad statement. There were many people worried about you and your fellow servicemen.
There also were a lot of rich folks making money while the poor were getting killed.

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Old May 22nd, 2013, 09:42 AM
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Default Alot of poor grunts died or were wounded in Vietnam while the rich made money

Quote:
Originally Posted by Manuel View Post
There also were a lot of rich folks making money while the poor were getting killed.

TM
You got it in one. Unfortunately the military industrial complex grinds continues to live on the blood of young Americans. In these latest conflicts the cream of American's sociery is being diluted with every casualty report. These men and women
didn't have to go to the military, but they chose to do it. True they are looking for rewards in life whether it be education benefits, pensions or even a good career, but they are also performing a needed service.
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Old May 25th, 2013, 06:53 AM
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There is not any nation on earth dumb enough to attack the USA. Invasion is out of the question as they would find a gun behind every rock, as long as we are allowed to keep our guns.

The USA needs to bring our troops home and mind our own business! Remember that terrorism is a tactic. There is no single nation behind terrorism. We took out the head Osama Bin Laden and all his top brass who committed 9/11, so what are our troops still doing in Afghanistan?

We had no business in Korea, we had no business being in Vietnam either. Desert Shield and the Iraq war was something we never should of gotten into either.
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Old May 25th, 2013, 08:50 AM
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There is not any nation on earth dumb enough to attack the USA.
However, there are number of groups and individuals that are.

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Old May 25th, 2013, 05:15 PM
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Quote:
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There also were a lot of rich folks making money while the poor were getting killed.
Manuel, you are hitting the nail on the head.

Luanne, of course every American cares about our soldiers, but that misses the point.

In Vietnam, about 50,000 kids died for nothing. No goal. No domino effect. No Communism in Australia. Instead we have business-class seats on Vietnam Airlines and a booming economy in Hanoi.

Repeat in Iraq. No military objective. Just a lot of pointless death and $billions drained from the United States treasury. For nothing.

If Bush had been president in 1941, the United States would have attacked Italy immediately after Pearl Harbor, bungled the war effort, destroyed our economy, and declared "mission accomplished" when Mussolini was strung up in 1955.

However, it is a fact that Cheney's cronies profited tremendously from the Iraq war. The soldiers, not so much.
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Old May 27th, 2013, 06:34 AM
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The very sad element in these Mideast wars is that they don't seem to have an end and continue to be a drain on the American economy. We continue to hear about Sunnis and Shites slaughtering each other in Iraq. Syria continues to be a hot war and could bring the US and Russia
into a war as it almost did in Croatia. Iran still has the atomic bomb threat which will continue to have a radical leadership. Israel will continue to be a war ground. These problems seem to be irreconcillable. The people have internal hatred for each other which will never be reconcilled until one or the other is dead.
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Old June 15th, 2013, 06:40 AM
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Default USA still trying to use diplomacy even though they are giving rebels weapons?

Obama administration says they are still using diplomacy to settle Syrian problem while throwing gasoline on the fire by giving rebels weapons. Sounds like the administration dosn't is heading toward a confrontation with Russia. We shall see if the administration follows Senator McCains lead and goes for no-fly zone establishment in Syria. He says that cratering the Syrian airfields will not risk American lives what he doesn't say is what happens if Syrians are killed or even worse if Russians are killed.
Will Russia respond with increased aid to Syrian administration.
We shall see.
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Old June 20th, 2013, 02:18 AM
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In Vietnam, about 50,000 kids died for nothing. No goal. No domino effect. No Communism in Australia. Instead we have business-class seats on Vietnam Airlines and a booming economy in Hanoi.

Actually, United States Armed Forces losses were a bit north of 50,000. 58,220 to be exact.

And let us not forget the 303,644 United States service personnel wounded.

While many believe U.S. involvement in French Indochina, later Viet Nam to be about 1965 to 1975, it actually began with the insertion of United States Army military advisors in 1950.

The war began officially 1 November 1955, and ended 30 April 1975.

The news media report that the Afghan War is the longest in United States history, when in actuality, the Vietnam war remains the longest war in United States history.

There are those who will state the United States military involvement ended 15 August 1973, with the Case-Church amendment passed by Congress. Armed Forces personnel, and embassy guards will tell that when in contact with the enemy, and returning fire, you are engaged in combat. Combat operations officially ended as the last Huey UH-1 left the United States embassy in Saigon, 30 April 1975.
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Old June 20th, 2013, 02:37 AM
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Originally Posted by iconic View Post

Senator McCains lead and goes for no-fly zone establishment in Syria. He says that cratering the Syrian airfields will not risk American lives what he doesn't say is what happens if Syrians are killed or even worse if Russians are killed.

Cratering Syrian airfields is particularly easy.

For example, 19 March 2011, as part of Operation Odessy Dawn, the Libyan adventure, United States Navy Ohio-class ballistic missile submarine, USS Florida SSGN 728, fired 93 Tomahawk cruise missiles, out of her magazine of 160, at Libyan air defense installations, 90 of which were combat effective.

As for killing Russian, or even Chinese personnel, the United States Armed Forces killed 16 Russian personnel; and 1446 Chinese personnel, 4200 wounded, during the Vietnam War without touching off World War III.
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Old June 20th, 2013, 05:19 AM
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Quote:
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I have scars myself. I am collecting a disability payment from issues that I picked up in Vietnam.
As one who appreciates very much your service to our nation, I want to say: Thank You.


Quote:
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So I don't have to worry. You all can worry for me, because none of you were worried when I was under fire in the Southeast Asian war games.

TM
Not true.

I remember '68 very well. I watched Tet unfold on television as it happened. I remember the Marines holding out at Khe Sanh, and the destruction of Hue.

I remember my next-door neighbor, Jimmy, a United States Marine, coming home from his second tour, and how happy we were that he was back home.

My dad worked the night shift at the Portland Main Branch of the Post Office, and my family sat down to dinner at about 4:30 in the afternoon so that we could eat dinner together before he left for work. So that we could catch up with the day's news, we had the TV on during dinner. And I got to see the Vietnam war live and in living color. (In 1968, some TV shows were still broadcast in black & white.)

As weird as this sounds, the Vietnam War was normal to me. The war had been going on my entire life, and I didn't know any different. It was normal that war coverage was on every night. That updated body counts, and US losses were an everyday occurance. That Walter Cronkite was on TV to report it all.

And you're right -- I didn't worry about you personally. I didn't know you in 1968. I worried about my friends and neighbors. I worried about my neighbor, Jimmy. Jimmy was a United States Marine infantryman. Marines served 13-month tours, and Jimmy was just home, on leave, from his second tour. I was very relieved to hear that Jimmy wasn't volunteering for a third tour, and was staying home.

The Jimmy that came home wasn't the Jimmy that left, and in 1968, I didn't get that. But Jimmy was home, and that was good enough for me.

That's alot to deal with for a 7-year-old in 1968.

I worried about everybody that I knew that went off to war. And there were far too many of them. Everybody was getting drafted, and I wondered who was going to be next. When I had to register with the Selective Service, I wondered if I'd be shipped off to war.

I remember seeing on TV, servicemen coming home at the airports, and young women spitting on them, and calling them "baby killers."

As odd as it sounds, I remember quite alot from the late '60's. I remember the hippies with their tie-dyed shirts, and jeans with holes in them. Their long hair, and glasses with round lenses. And it was "peace, brother" everywhere.

And I remember the sit-ins at Portland State, in '69 and '70. Where Portland Police were called in to break up the protests. And when students were getting anti-war tattos, and when the young student famously whipped her top off to get her tatoo.

I wasn't there with you. From the Delta to the DMZ I was too young -- when the party ended, I was 14 years old.

If it makes any difference, I was with you in spirit. My dad was a United States Navy combat veteran. Aboard United States Navy heavy cruiser, USS Chicago CA 29, as gun captain, left gun, turret 3, he fought at Coral Sea, Savo Island, Rennell Island. I grew up in the '60's the son of a United States Navy Gun Captain.

If it makes any difference, I was concerned about you guys since my earliest memories. I wasn't sure what we were fighting for; all I knew was that I wanted you guys to win.
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Old June 20th, 2013, 05:27 PM
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The tension between Putin and Obama was obvious at the Group 8 meeting. What it looks like now is that US military and political experts are arguing a Syrian administration victory will mean an opportunity for Russia and Iran to change the balance of power in the Mideast. I can see Obama's advisors saying we can't let the power shift occur. Guess what they will encourage him to do.
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Old June 20th, 2013, 05:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aidan View Post
Manuel, you are hitting the nail on the head.

Luanne, of course every American cares about our soldiers, but that misses the point.

In Vietnam, about 50,000 kids died for nothing. No goal. No domino effect. No Communism in Australia. Instead we have business-class seats on Vietnam Airlines and a booming economy in Hanoi.

Repeat in Iraq. No military objective. Just a lot of pointless death and $billions drained from the United States treasury. For nothing.

If Bush had been president in 1941, the United States would have attacked Italy immediately after Pearl Harbor, bungled the war effort, destroyed our economy, and declared "mission accomplished" when Mussolini was strung up in 1955.

However, it is a fact that Cheney's cronies profited tremendously from the Iraq war. The soldiers, not so much.
Aiden,

Do you realize you just said that some of the nice people on here, who went to Nam, did it for nothing?
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Old July 1st, 2013, 12:29 AM
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Aiden,

Do you realize you just said that some of the nice people on here, who went to Nam, did it for nothing?
Yes, Luanne, I'm especially sympathetic to the poor fellows who got caught up in that foolisness.

"Get the government off our backs!". Indeed. Conservatives have an erection for that illusive concept, except for war. Then they are gung ho as long as they don't have to participate.

Luanne, the kids were drafted. Cheney was exempt.

And the point of the war, again, was? ......
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Old July 1st, 2013, 01:10 AM
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Yes, Luanne, I'm especially sympathetic to the poor fellows who got caught up in that foolisness.

"Get the government off our backs!". Indeed. Conservatives have an erection for that illusive concept, except for war. Then they are gung ho as long as they don't have to participate.

Luanne, the kids were drafted. Cheney was exempt.

And the point of the war, again, was? ......

I suppose being a "super power" comes the need to come to the aid of those who need us.

I suspect we will one day soon, not be that great nation, and those who wish to see us fall, will get their wish.

What use to make us strong was a strong economy, with jobs, free enterprise, strong leadership. Our Constitution was something that we all believed in, and used to guide us.

I would be shocked if the US became involved in any war. I don't know what we are still doing in Afghanistan, and I suspect the withdrawal will be another big change for this country, when it does finally happen.

Most likely our next war will be within our own country.
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Old July 1st, 2013, 08:26 AM
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Aiden,

Do you realize you just said that some of the nice people on here, who went to Nam, did it for nothing?
Yes we did it for nothing! Not a single positive thing was accomplished by our involvement in Vietnam.
And now we can visit Communist Vietnam and trade with them but we can't visit our Caribbean neighbor because they are communist.

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Old July 1st, 2013, 10:16 AM
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You got it in one. Irarq and Afghanistan will fall into their tribal warfare and jehadists warfare as soon as US troops drop down. Iran already hates the US and can't wait to get the atomic bomb so that they can scare the world and blackmail it just as North Korea has done. Syria is a mess and the weapons the Obama administration is shipping to "co" rebels will increase this problem even if nobody listens Obama's war monger lapdog Senator McCain scream for no fly zone. And now we have, Egypt heating up with rioting and what if the Muslim Brotherhood president unleashes the army on the protesters. Next we will hear that the Obama administration start sending arms to the Egyptian rebels to offset the arms the US has shipped to the Egyptian military.
And if you believe that the Arabs the US can depend on are the Saudi Arabian Kings and princes and the leaders in Quatar and UAR, just wait and see as time reveals their payoffs of terrorists organizations.




Thank you for bringing the US to a wait until they start to sniff the acrid air of the Arab Spring. which Obama has been so jubilant about.
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Old July 1st, 2013, 09:52 PM
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I suppose being a "super power" comes the need to come to the aid of those who need us.

I suspect we will one day soon, not be that great nation, and those who wish to see us fall, will get their wish.

What use to make us strong was a strong economy, with jobs, free enterprise, strong leadership. Our Constitution was something that we all believed in, and used to guide us.

I would be shocked if the US became involved in any war. I don't know what we are still doing in Afghanistan, and I suspect the withdrawal will be another big change for this country, when it does finally happen.

Most likely our next war will be within our own country.
I think, in confusing times, it is best to look to the wisdom of our Founding Fathers.

"All wars are follies, very expensive and very mischievous ones." -- Benjamin Franklin
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Old July 2nd, 2013, 03:12 AM
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Default France, Italy and GB would have the US go it alone.

Nobody even talks about the economic situation of the US allies. The French, British and Italian economies are in the dumpster. the French are selling off state assets to try and pay for their socialism. Great Britian is cutting back on their military budget. Italy is no where to be seen.

Even though the US has somewhat of a fragile economy the military and military contractors in the US see the opportunity in new wars.
So expect the flames of war to be fanned by McCain and the humanitarians in the Obama administration.

Just as a side note on the economy, because of sequestering one military base had to cut back on Fourth of July expenditures this year last year they spent $125,000 on fireworks last year. Chump change to the military.

Sequestering is such a bad word to the Obama administration it has been stricken from their lexicon. It's like the word "parley" was stricken from the dictionery of the pirates in the Pirates of the Carribean movie.

In Egypt the military has told the president to resolve the
situation. Fat chance. The Islamic Brotherhood member, that wonderful group of democratic group of peace lovers are marching with big sticks. Are their any cruises still going to Egypt?

You know the women of America are lucky. They should count their blessings. They can wear body hugging swim suits in competitive swimming to improve their performance, but the Iranian swimmer had her prize taken away from her because her bathing suit was too revealing.
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Old July 2nd, 2013, 08:39 AM
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Nobody even talks about the economic situation of the US allies. The French, British and Italian economies are in the dumpster. the French are selling off state assets to try and pay for their socialism. Great Britian is cutting back on their military budget. Italy is no where to be seen.

Even though the US has somewhat of a fragile economy the military and military contractors in the US see the opportunity in new wars.
So expect the flames of war to be fanned by McCain and the humanitarians in the Obama administration.

Just as a side note on the economy, because of sequestering one military base had to cut back on Fourth of July expenditures this year last year they spent $125,000 on fireworks last year. Chump change to the military.

Sequestering is such a bad word to the Obama administration it has been stricken from their lexicon. It's like the word "parley" was stricken from the dictionery of the pirates in the Pirates of the Carribean movie.

In Egypt the military has told the president to resolve the
situation. Fat chance. The Islamic Brotherhood member, that wonderful group of democratic group of peace lovers are marching with big sticks. Are their any cruises still going to Egypt?

You know the women of America are lucky. They should count their blessings. They can wear body hugging swim suits in competitive swimming to improve their performance, but the Iranian swimmer had her prize taken away from her because her bathing suit was too revealing.
I am not sure where to begin. I agree with paragraph one.

Paragraph two I am not sure what you are getting at. There is more than one post that have cancelled the fireworks this year. Do you know how much those fireworks mean to the soldiers and their families? Fireworks on military posts are usually an all day affair. It is a time when soldiers can bring their families, have free food, and entertainment offered for free by those who know how much they have worked on behalf of this country.

It isn't the same as Boston, NY, or Vegas where the fireworks bring in tourists to generate money for the cities, this is for the soldiers. I am sure you are an expert on soldiers, but maybe there are those who have no idea what their lives have been like. These are Americans who have spent more time away from their families than with them. This is people who grow their families, but are many times not their to see them born. These are people who are mostly below to poverty line, who many times have to reach out to food stamps to feed their families. Not one of these families begged for war, they just go and do what needs to be done.

The Fourth of July should be for the soldiers. They are the reason for the fireworks.

Even though the US has somewhat of a fragile economy the military and military contractors in the US see the opportunity in new wars.
So expect the flames of war to be fanned by McCain and the humanitarians in the Obama administration.

Did you really say this?

I am not sure I should be sad or angry at this statement. I will just leave it alone. I would ask my husband about it, but he went to work long before you got up, and if his hours were computed like "normal" workers, it would be close to minimum wage. Yes, your right, he could find a "real" job just like you, and make real money, but his heart is with his country. He and so many others, are the reason to have a Fourth of July.

Let's talk about sequester. This idea was put together by the Obama administration in order to get Congress to do what they wanted them to do. It back fired. President Obama isn't sequestered, but we are. It starts on the 8th of July. Not only is it hard to keep up with rising costs, but now we have to do without a days pay, each week, until Oct.

So I don't know what the 4th means to you, but for us, it's a chance to remember where we've been, and where the country is going.

Happy Fourth of July everyone. God Bless America, and those who give so much, and especially those who gave all.
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  #27 (permalink)  
Old July 3rd, 2013, 06:31 PM
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Originally Posted by Luanne Russo View Post
I am not sure where to begin. I agree with paragraph one.

Paragraph two I am not sure what you are getting at. There is more than one post that have cancelled the fireworks this year. Do you know how much those fireworks mean to the soldiers and their families? Fireworks on military posts are usually an all day affair. It is a time when soldiers can bring their families, have free food, and entertainment offered for free by those who know how much they have worked on behalf of this country.

It isn't the same as Boston, NY, or Vegas where the fireworks bring in tourists to generate money for the cities, this is for the soldiers. I am sure you are an expert on soldiers, but maybe there are those who have no idea what their lives have been like. These are Americans who have spent more time away from their families than with them. This is people who grow their families, but are many times not their to see them born. These are people who are mostly below to poverty line, who many times have to reach out to food stamps to feed their families. Not one of these families begged for war, they just go and do what needs to be done.

The Fourth of July should be for the soldiers. They are the reason for the fireworks.

Even though the US has somewhat of a fragile economy the military and military contractors in the US see the opportunity in new wars.
So expect the flames of war to be fanned by McCain and the humanitarians in the Obama administration.

Did you really say this?

I am not sure I should be sad or angry at this statement. I will just leave it alone. I would ask my husband about it, but he went to work long before you got up, and if his hours were computed like "normal" workers, it would be close to minimum wage. Yes, your right, he could find a "real" job just like you, and make real money, but his heart is with his country. He and so many others, are the reason to have a Fourth of July.

Let's talk about sequester. This idea was put together by the Obama administration in order to get Congress to do what they wanted them to do. It back fired. President Obama isn't sequestered, but we are. It starts on the 8th of July. Not only is it hard to keep up with rising costs, but now we have to do without a days pay, each week, until Oct.

So I don't know what the 4th means to you, but for us, it's a chance to remember where we've been, and where the country is going.

Happy Fourth of July everyone. God Bless America, and those who give so much, and especially those who gave all.
Government shows backbone and refuses free fireworks show.
At Camp LeJeune 47000 Sailors and Marines willl not have fireworks show even though the Zambelli offered to do the show for FREE.
The government said no to the offer because there would ba cost $50-75,000 dollars for other costs connected with a Fourth of July celebration. The government said that because of sequestering they could not approve this expenditure even if the fireworks show is free.
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  #28 (permalink)  
Old July 4th, 2013, 06:18 AM
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Default Free Zambelli family fireworks offer extraordinary. True patriots.

The Zambelli family demonstrated that they are true patriots by offering a free fireworks show at Camp LeJeune.
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  #29 (permalink)  
Old July 4th, 2013, 08:25 AM
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That is an honorable thing to do, but it is so much more than that. All of which costs money. We have concerts here, and I have never heard of any of the big name stars asking for money for their time, but it requires extra security, and the money is not there.

I admit there have been times that the military has spent to much money on things, but I don't think anyone realizes how much has been cut in the last year, and this is suppose to continue in the coming years, not just a one time thing.

But, it isn't new to the military community. We have seen times like this before. It is just a matter of waiting it out, until a new commander in chief comes into office.
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Old July 7th, 2013, 02:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Luanne Russo View Post

But, it isn't new to the military community. We have seen times like this before. It is just a matter of waiting it out, until a new commander in chief comes into office.
It is that entitlement attidute that is destroying America.

In case you hadn't noticed, the previous Commander In Chief destroyed the economy with unpaid wars.

The next guy is struggling to keep America afloat.

And all you can say is "gimme, gimme, gimme, it was better on the credit card!". Indeed it was, for the favored.

Your time has come to sacrifice for America, Luanne. Instead of whining about his government-teat running low on milk, maybe your husbsand should get a job in the private sector, like most of America!

And if that's not enough, maybe you should try for a better paying job.

Just like what everybody reading this is has experiencied!
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