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  #31 (permalink)  
Old July 26th, 2013, 12:47 PM
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I think the value is the facts, not what he said. I knew there were facts not allowed in evidence, but had no idea what that was.

I also wondered why the prosecution focused so much on the candy and tea.

I also wondered what was so important with Treyvon's texting.

This video answers a lot of the questions I had, and probably other people as well.

One of these days, maybe Treyvon's family can do a video to young people about the dangers of mixing things found in many stores, that can cause personality changes in young people.

I spoke to my brother in Atlanta this morning, and he said these facts were well known there, and Jim knew of the combination of store items in order to get high, because of the dangers of soldiers doing it.

Bottom line is a young man is dead, and his killers life has changed forever.

If those who make a living off of race, would turn their energy's towards helping the young people we still have on this earth, I would be behind them all the way.
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Old July 26th, 2013, 01:42 PM
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I concur 100%....which leads to the logical question

Is there a public figure today,....that all Americans if not trust, at least feel would be fair and objective in today's divisive environment

The last person that I can think of is Walter Cronkite
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Old July 26th, 2013, 02:14 PM
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I just watched Teyvon's mother give a speech in Philly. At one point she said no one knew her hurt, but she was wrong. I know that pain so much.
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  #34 (permalink)  
Old July 26th, 2013, 02:48 PM
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If "Mr. Wonder" is jumping to conclusions so are many other entertainers. The list of those who have decided not to play Florida is becoming quite extensive. As far as the video goes, no comment.
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  #35 (permalink)  
Old July 27th, 2013, 10:22 PM
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The issue isn't the so-called "unfairness" of the free market response to who kills who.

The issue is a law that permits a citizen to stalk and confront another in a public place, pick a fight, and then kill if the fight doesn't go his way.

I wonder what the response will be here if somebody happens to spot Zimmerman, and happens to stalk him, and happens to confront him in a public space, and happens to feel threatened, and happens to kill him. Perfectly legal in Florida.
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Old July 27th, 2013, 11:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aidan View Post
The issue isn't the so-called "unfairness" of the free market response to who kills who.

The issue is a law that permits a citizen to stalk and confront another in a public place, pick a fight, and then kill if the fight doesn't go his way.

I wonder what the response will be here if somebody happens to spot Zimmerman, and happens to stalk him, and happens to confront him in a public space, and happens to feel threatened, and happens to kill him. Perfectly legal in Florida.

Community Watch Someone that watches over a neighborhood, and reports anyone who looks out of place. It is not called stalking. That is an insult to those women who have really been stalked. He was told to get back in his car, but before that 911 asked where the person had gone. He started back to his truck, and the stranger jumped out at him, and hit him in the nose, knocking him down. He never laid a hand on him. When Z thought his life was in danger, after yelling help, he shot him. This is all evidence in the trial from witnesses.

As I have said, that baby should be home tonight, with family, not in a grave, but if you are going to comment on the case, PLEASE use the facts.
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  #37 (permalink)  
Old July 28th, 2013, 04:20 AM
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You will probably hear on national media on Monday, that last Friday in New Orleans a 14 year old Black youth was shot (and in critical condition) by a White homeowner who said the youth was trepassing in his yard and felt his family life was in danger (he invoked Stand Your Ground when the police arrived)

NOPD arrested the homeowner and will be in court early this week to face charges

Two separate and unique cases that illustrates how Stand Your Ground statue varies per state and how it is applied (in LA you cannot use deadly force for trepassing in a homeowner's yard, unless they physically try to enter your home or car).

Lessons learned from recent events will hopefully be applied.
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  #38 (permalink)  
Old July 28th, 2013, 08:00 PM
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You will probably hear on national media on Monday, that last Friday in New Orleans a 14 year old Black youth was shot (and in critical condition) by a White homeowner who said the youth was trepassing in his yard and felt his family life was in danger (he invoked Stand Your Ground when the police arrived)

NOPD arrested the homeowner and will be in court early this week to face charges

Two separate and unique cases that illustrates how Stand Your Ground statue varies per state and how it is applied (in LA you cannot use deadly force for trepassing in a homeowner's yard, unless they physically try to enter your home or car).

Lessons learned from recent events will hopefully be applied.
I hope and pray that "lessons learned from recent events will hopefully be applied" but can you say open season.
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Old July 29th, 2013, 01:51 AM
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Let us pray that is not the case...so far the NOPD, community leaders and the local media have come together to treat it for what it is...a tragic incident that is being investigate as a stand alone incident...according to the local media, there is video from crime cameras (there is a business next door)....also the NOPD detained and arrested the man on the spot (he posted bond awaiting his hearing this week) and the local media and NOPD spokesperson stressed this incident is not another Travon Martin situation and went into great detail why the two situations are different under state law

Let's pray that the national media stay out of this event...I will be watching both FOX and MSNBC during prime time this evening

It does however illustate the need to review all of the states that the Stand Your Ground statue is in effect, how it is applied, how the judicial process and outcomes vary due to race, economics, location, gun laws in each state etc. This I think is what the Justice Department is doing now and best use of it's resources

Parents of sons are seeking resources to guide them in the conversation about how to make our sons not a target
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Old July 29th, 2013, 02:21 PM
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ok, I see.
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Old July 29th, 2013, 03:58 PM
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Where's Jackson and Sharpton on this one; Adams Morgan hate crime was motivated by Zimmerman verdict, police say - The Washington Post

Granted, this victim was not murdered, but why when it's a white victim it's called a 'hate crime' and no one seems to even notice it and it barely makes local news, yet when it's a black victim, it's called a 'racist' crime, makes international news, and out come such radicals as Jackson and Sharpton to stir up trouble?

Just saying.

None of these crimes are right no matter how you put a spin on it. Crime is crime and should be treated as such based on the law and the evidence, not based on public opinion that is biased by misinformation and non-facts by the press or a few vocal people with a hidden agenda. Lady Justice should always be blind - it's too bad the rest of us aren't.

"I have a dream that my four little children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin, but by the content of their character." Martin Luther King

Amen!
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  #42 (permalink)  
Old July 29th, 2013, 05:23 PM
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As much as we all would like to think Justice is Blind...the reality is very different...heck we were all raised to believe the SCOTUS consisted of jurors, who because they are appointed for life, thus are immuned by political whims, by design provide the check and balance between the other two branches of government...well we all know that's not true

One of my alltime favorite tv shows is Law & Order, especially the older shows, because it showed the flaws and warts of our legal system....justice is not fair...if you have deep pockets or political connections, you experience one type of justice, if you are poor and cannot afford legal counsel, you experience another

Hate crime is a growing problem in our Country
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Old July 29th, 2013, 06:31 PM
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Just pure hate is growing. What we need is someone who doesn't stir the pot, but one who will calm everyone down.

I wish MLK could come back, just long enough for people to listen to him again. When he spoke, there was much hate, and no rights. Now their are rights, but the hate on both sides are growing.

We also need more prayer, and less JZ, and Justine B.

Churches need to hold hands and pull people together.
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  #44 (permalink)  
Old July 29th, 2013, 08:00 PM
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Remember, both MLK & RFK were murdered, in small part because they were able to bring different races together

After Church last Sunday, I spoke with a member that is a 5th grade teacher in a public school and happens to be my neighbor...she wanted to know if my son would visit her classroom in full fighter pilot gear so her students could learn about his journey...he speaks to students all the time...he sometimes ferries F-15's from Hickham to Langley so hopefully he can arrange a fuel stop at Belle Chasse in New Orleans and her class can do a field trip

I'm thinking about adapting her classroom and asking her to reach out to her counterpart in one of the all White private "academies" in our Parish and plan some activities that will take each out of their "comfort" zones to help build relationships. If we can pull it together I am going to approach Bill O'Reilly to fund our efforts (hypocrites make the best source of funding) using our mutual Marist College connections

5th grade seems the right age because they still have dreams that paths can be made for
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  #45 (permalink)  
Old July 29th, 2013, 08:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cruise planner View Post
Where's Jackson and Sharpton on this one; Adams Morgan hate crime was motivated by Zimmerman verdict, police say - The Washington Post

Granted, this victim was not murdered, but why when it's a white victim it's called a 'hate crime' and no one seems to even notice it and it barely makes local news, yet when it's a black victim, it's called a 'racist' crime, makes international news, and out come such radicals as Jackson and Sharpton to stir up trouble?

Just saying.

None of these crimes are right no matter how you put a spin on it. Crime is crime and should be treated as such based on the law and the evidence, not based on public opinion that is biased by misinformation and non-facts by the press or a few vocal people with a hidden agenda. Lady Justice should always be blind - it's too bad the rest of us aren't.

"I have a dream that my four little children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin, but by the content of their character." Martin Luther King

Amen!
Jackson and Sharpton are not radicals .Jackson ,an ordained minister is into only one thing ,his ego.
Sharpton who was never ordained is into only one thing ,seeing his face on TV .
Radicals were people like Malcolm X , Nelson Mandela ,Abbie Hoffman .
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Old July 29th, 2013, 09:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lakers Fan View Post
Jackson and Sharpton are not radicals .Jackson ,an ordained minister is into only one thing ,his ego.
Sharpton who was never ordained is into only one thing ,seeing his face on TV .
Radicals were people like Malcolm X , Nelson Mandela ,Abbie Hoffman .
I'll agree - perhaps the wrong word. Maybe more of an activist with a personal agenda might describe them better.

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Old July 29th, 2013, 09:09 PM
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Yes ,personal agenda activist ,a perfect description.
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Old July 29th, 2013, 09:17 PM
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Originally Posted by venice View Post
Remember, both MLK & RFK were murdered, in small part because they were able to bring different races together

After Church last Sunday, I spoke with a member that is a 5th grade teacher in a public school and happens to be my neighbor...she wanted to know if my son would visit her classroom in full fighter pilot gear so her students could learn about his journey...he speaks to students all the time...he sometimes ferries F-15's from Hickham to Langley so hopefully he can arrange a fuel stop at Belle Chasse in New Orleans and her class can do a field trip

I'm thinking about adapting her classroom and asking her to reach out to her counterpart in one of the all White private "academies" in our Parish and plan some activities that will take each out of their "comfort" zones to help build relationships. If we can pull it together I am going to approach Bill O'Reilly to fund our efforts (hypocrites make the best source of funding) using our mutual Marist College connections

5th grade seems the right age because they still have dreams that paths can be made for
I loved everything you said until you mentioned O"Reilly. He is trying to make a difference, and has been under the gun for what? Caring? For the record, Bill O'Reilly taught school in Miami for many years in a school no one else would bother to try. He probably would in fact help fund something to help relations. Of course you were not serious, because you bothered to call him a name.

This is what is wrong. Blacks who tell the truth are called Uncle Toms, Whites offer opinions, and they are called hypocrites. That leaves people who would rather break store windows, and call names than to get help. I don't get it.

I hope you son can help those classes, but warn him if he is not black enough, he will be put down.

You know a good start would be to allow blacks to have an opinion, without repeating what the race baiters say they should say.
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Old July 29th, 2013, 10:18 PM
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Then we will have to agree to disagree about him...I know he receive a stong foundation under the Catholic Marist Brothers in college in terms of accepting people of all races but if you study the body of his life's work, I stand by my statement...he has used his platform not to advance race relations but to profit (very well I might add) because of it, He knows better and I would expect better from him. Rush Limbaugh doesn't

I remember when I first came on these boards, the famous statement that based upon my postings I did not "sound Black" (remember?)

It's a good thing we have "virtual history" because anyone else who is reading this thread would be leary about your statement concerning my son, but I will extend to you a courtesy. Would you tell your son he is not "White enough " if he spoke to a class? "It is very important that young African American males come into contact with as many positive male role models as possible while they are in the formulate years, They need to see real life examples that with hard work and support they can achieve anything in life regardless of color. But they are also observant of how our POTUS is attacked not only for his politics but because of his race..he played by all the rules and defies racial sterotypes...in many ways after seeing the movie 42, it reminds me of how much Jackie Robinson went thru

If my little project pans out, I know I can count on you for support..my first outing will be to have my integrated 5th graders help out at a Special Olympics event..lots of lessons for them
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Old July 29th, 2013, 10:43 PM
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fyi....when a real live Air Force Lt Col. Top Gun F-15 fighter pilot walks into a 5th grade classroom in a flight suit with his helmet on , the kids pay attention and they are not looking at the color of his skin....when they touch his framed PhD and find out he was an All American in college, hopefully the message about the importance of an education will reinforce what their teacher has been teaching them about math and science
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Old July 31st, 2013, 01:51 PM
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I will always be supportive of anyone who wants to advance forward. I was discussed with the statement about Mr. OReilly. I have heard his statement, and then the doctored statement from NBC, and what they wanted Bill to say.

The people who give me hope in the AA community are the blacks who are standing up and saying enough is enough. They are called names because they won't repeat what the Race baiters say.

But, you know what? The wooo is me is over. It is time for the blacks to stand up, and not depend on anyone but themselves. I swear I close my eyes, and it sounds like 1960 all over again.

Blacks have what I have and even more. They also have a black president. Has he called out the troops to stop the killing of blacks in Chicago? Has he talked about the education that is going down hill?

Sadly, the spokes person for AA is a nut. He lives off of race discrimination.

But I will make a prediction. If it keeps on, and if good white people are continually called a racist, it will only get worse. You think the N word is bad for you? What about being called a racist for me?

I will always stand with you, even when you feel the need to call a good man a name. I also have had your son and grandson in my prayers every night. I know you raised a good man, and are very proud of him.

You know me Venice. You know my heart, but it hurts when Mr. O'Reilly tries to help, and he is condemned. If he can't speak the truth, then what the hell good will I be able to do?

One last thing. I cried the first night I heard Mr. O'Reilly's speech. He spoke of the bad influence Rap videos have on the youth. Did you know that Joe's killer said he learned to turn the gun sideways from a video?

He talked about the break down of the AA families. Again, that was our case with Joe's killer. He talked about the lack of a father in the family. Again our case.

All of this can be done in the AA community to stop it. I don't mean a march on Washington, I mean getting in the communities.

I know that is what you are trying to do, but isn't it time the top starts doing the same thing?

Heck, I don't have to do anything. But to do nothing is not in my heart.
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  #52 (permalink)  
Old July 31st, 2013, 03:16 PM
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Luanne...don't get suck into the debate currently bring waged primarily thru social media and cable tv between the conservative/liberal, Black/White, O'Riley/Sharpton, Limbaugh/Joyner, Hannity/Jackson, Obama/Republicans...it only serves as a misdirect to draw the attention away from what is really going on and just increases ratings thru ad revenues

There are two primary forms of racism...overt/covert...the word "racists" is being thrown around by all parties without understanding the context of the word or the implication of the results ...overt racism has a long and inglorious history in America (see Reconstruction Era) and is what most folks thought we were passed when the Voting Rights Bill was passed in 1965 which was the major goal of the Civil Roghts Struggle (which is why the 50th Anniversary March is important)...covert racism which is more in practice today, is a much more subtle (but even more odious then overt) institutional process that is being used to surpress or roll back progress made by the Civil Rights struggle thru legal or political
means (the White Citizens Council no longer puts up a sign that says I am not allowed to enter their place of business, but puts in place a school voucher program that allow my tax $$$ to be used to fund a private Christian Academy that was established to exclude my child in the first place). The immigration debate is a classic example of covert racism. And fyi..the conservative Republican party that we see today is the conservative Democratic ( Dixiecrats ) party prior to the 1965 Voting Rights Act

It was easy to spot and call out a racist back in the day because they made no attempt to hide it (except for the KKK)....it is much harder to do the same today, because they do hide it (and take offense if called one )...the SCOTUS decisions in the Reconstruction Era look alot like what we are seeing in the Robert's court these days...to me, the only difference is the color of the robe (I could write a thesis on Justice Thomas)

On election eve of 2008, there were probably only 5 people (Barrack, Michelle, Valarie Jarrett, David Axlerod, Tom Joyner) who actually thought our Country would elect a leader of color. The reaction by the White political establisment the next morning set in motion the collusion of the force of overt/covert actions that have gotten us to this point today. The election night coverage by FOX (including O'Reily but especially Karl Rove) confirmed that for me. By the way, I don't know of any AA that consider ourselves "victims"...I think that is a b.s. line used by the self interest on both sides of the race debate....the right of and access to vote takes a person from being a victim to one of being empowered...today's military is the best example that we both have in common where when barriers are removed and educational and leadership opportunires are made available, no one is a victim or makes excuses

So today when I hear the "r" or the "n" word banter, I make a judgement whether the "c" or the "o" definition applies. I have experienced both and know the difference. Most folks (especially under 40) both Black/White have not experience both first hand and therefore use the term without understanding the context. Exception to the rule is a "mixed" couple.

In the very near future Hispanics will be the largest minority in our Country if combined with AA will be the majority. That really scares a certain segment of this Country
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Old July 31st, 2013, 04:35 PM
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Luanne..because of what happened to your family you bring a unique perspective to the Travon Martin situation. I would hope that you don't allow other people that don't know you or your situation define who you are or your perspective to race relations. You and Jim have a special bond with Travon's parents that hopefully will be able to make a positive contribution to the dialogue

All cable stations edit to fit their agenda...that's why I love The Daily Show & Colbert Report because they expose it

Fyi...O'Reiley didn't tell the rest of the story...my son/grandson could have done everything right (according to Bill) and still be shot by a GZ because they didn't "look right" in my neighborhood. Bill plays the narrative that plays to his base

Go on YouTube and find the video about 4 years ago when Rev. Sharpton took O'Reiley to dinner at a famous soul food place in Harlem, and the follow up show where O'Reiley talks about that dinner experience. It gives alot of insight into his bias
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Old July 31st, 2013, 04:54 PM
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I have heard the tape, or both tapes about the interview (radio) after the dinner at the Harlem restaurant. Have you heard both? One is the real tape, and the other is one that either Sharpton edited, or NBC.

The radio show was an AA named Williams. He verified that the NBC tape is edited.

Same words, but cut to make BO seem like a racist.

I am telling you that Sharpton has an agenda, and if innocent AA's get in the way, to bad for them, because he is watching out for #1

Have you heard the tapes of Sharpton saying all whites are devils? It not just audio but video as well.

My question is why is he #1? I can name you 30 AA's who care about all of us. Who are smart enough to know that we are all in this together.

Also please explain to me why the AA community isn't up in arms about the way Obama is handling things?

What kind of person would trash someone trying to help, if he really cared about his people? Is it more important that the troubles remain, so he remains important? (Sharpton)
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Old July 31st, 2013, 06:21 PM
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I only saw O'Reiley's tape...never saw Sharpton's (don't watch his show)...Bill acted "surprise" , which is in and of itself. Insulting to me

Sharpton (as well as O'Reiley) all have agendas and both are dismissive of anyone on their respective shows that don't agree with them...I always enjoy when Juan Williams and Bill go at it

The power of the POTUS has always been the "bully pulpit". POTUS does not introduce or pass legislation...The party that controls both the White House and the legislative branch has the best chance of getting things accomplished...the SCOTUS is suppose to be the branch that is above the political fray, but we all know how it works in reality. However life continues to amaze us...POTUS appoint justices who don't always follow the script...the most famous Earl Warren

The reelection of POTUS O''Bama was not a validation that he was doing a good job, rather it was a validation that middle American understood that the Repulican party strategy of obstruction (in the middle of the greatest recession since the Great Depression) was not in the spirit of doing what's best for our Country...In perhaps the greatest political irony of modern times, the RNC focused on voter suppression of the traditional DNC coalition, and instead 5M+ White Male voters who usually vote straight Republican stayed away...they may not like the POTUS but they disliked Romney more and the RNC tactics...kharma, who knew...by traditional standards, POTUS should have lost based on the economy (i.e. Carter)...Citizens United poured $$$$ and FOX pounded POTUS 24/7 for 7 years

You might ask military families who have endured multiple long deployments in two war zones how they feel about not having to go back for another..you might ask employees over 50, who thru no fault of their own, lost their jobs at Enron, World Com, United or any other company that went bankrupt and lost their pension and health benefits and due to the recession could not find another job in 6 months and 1 day and someone in their family had a pre existing condition how they feel..might ask auto workers (and the many small business owners that depend on them), how they feel...you might ask the 47% that Romney made reference to how they feel...you might ask the victims of any Hurricane or major flooding since Hurricane Katrina how they feel....they are not vocal, but I bet around the dinner table thankful...you might ask Bin Laden ....

To answer your question, I have at least 60 AA in my sub division that care very deeply about our 60 WA who are our neighbors. We have a recommittment ritual crawfish boil every year before the 1st major hurricane because after Katrina and Isaac we know that all our homes are the same

Fyi...you give Rev Sharpton far too much credit...he is just the only high profile AA that has a national platform thru his MSNBC show...he is not doing anything that Bill, Shawn and Rush don't do on their show and they have a much larger platform..hate the game, not the players

Just curious, what is your take on Newt Gingrich, John Boerner and Ann Coulter?
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Old July 31st, 2013, 07:48 PM
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Newt= blow hard

Ann= White Sharpton

Bohner= No Coconuts
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Old July 31st, 2013, 11:37 PM
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Gingrich apparently loves to cruise (remember in the primary, he took two weeks off to cruise the Greek isles)...he and Sharpton actually did an educational roadshow together...he is a graduate of Tulane University here in New Orleans...next time he speaks on campus, I am going to make a point to attend and invite him to join CruiseMates....lol

Coulter at one time dated Jimmy "JJ" Walker of Good Time Fame...based upon her famous comment that "ours are better than yours" it now makes sense......

When do you remember when the #3 person in line for POTUS make a statement that states don't judge Congress for the # of bills passed, judge but the # bills we prevent from passing

Maybe Sharpton will have all 3 on his program for a panel on how to fix the race challenge...they articulate solutions so well about it on FOX...lol

I really look forward to my smooth jazz cruise in 13 weeks...The Average White Band (ironic half the band is Black) and Larry Graham (Sly and the Family Stone) will be doing concerts on the lido deck on our full days at sea on the Carnival Freedom...it takes me back to my Woodstock days and reminds me how great music from the 60's & 70's brought fans of all colors together
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Old August 1st, 2013, 01:22 PM
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I was not at Woodstock but I was at other large outdoor concerts at the time .If anyone ever read Festival Songbook which has hundreds of pictures of people who were at the concerts there is a picture of me in it as well.
There was no racism there as Venice has stated.
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Old August 1st, 2013, 07:03 PM
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There was alot of free love and sharing :roll

The Gov ordered the State Police to shut down the NYS Thruway and tried to turn back any vehicles with "hippie looking occupants"..so I guess we would call that "profiling" today

The headliners were mostly folk /country artists (John Sebastian, Arlo Gutherie, Country Joe, Joan Baez, Crosby,Still,Nash, Richie Havens etc), which under normal circumstances, would not attract me..my friends and I went to gaze.at other attractions

Very few east coast music fans had ever heard of the bay area bands named Sly and The Family Stone and Santana or the English soul singer Joe Cocker...WABC disc jockey Bruce "Counsin Brucie" Morrow could not categorize their music and no one could figure out Hendrix

Both Santana & Sly's Bands were integrated and Sly's band featured female horn players which no one had ever seen before...Cocker was "blue eye soul"...Woodstock changed pop music acceptance by people of all colors forever...funny thing, we did not realize it at the time and sadly, it will never happen again in our lifetime
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Old August 1st, 2013, 10:20 PM
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In 1971 I was traveling by bus from Canada to the US .I had shoulder length hair and a long beard .Every guy on the bus who had long hair and a beard were taken off the bus .Our luggage was taken off the bus and everything taken out of the luggage.That was the beginning of profiling for me.
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