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Old December 6th, 2006, 11:28 AM
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Default Princess cruise line over Royal Caribbean

I am looking to book a cruise with Princess in 2007 and what I was wondering is, how do they compare to Royal Caribbean cruise line? Would you say they are equal to, better or less better? I've really enjoyed Royal Caribbean ships, staff, food and entertainment, and it would be a shame to try another cruise line that doesn't compare to them. Anyone who can share their opinions would be much appreciated

Thanks,
Jessie
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Old December 6th, 2006, 04:25 PM
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Jessie,

Quote:
Originally Posted by You
I am looking to book a cruise with Princess in 2007 and what I was wondering is, how do they compare to Royal Caribbean cruise line? Would you say they are equal to, better or less better? I've really enjoyed Royal Caribbean ships, staff, food and entertainment, and it would be a shame to try another cruise line that doesn't compare to them. Anyone who can share their opinions would be much appreciated
Princess Cruises operates in the "premium" segment of the cruise market whereas Royal Caribbean International operates in the "mainstream" cruise line. Thus, Princess should be slightly more expensive but offer more polish and a few extra touches -- at least in theory. In practice, I'm hearing from many sources that Princess has moved to the bottom of the "premium" tier and that Royal Caribbean has moved to the top of the "mainstream" tier -- and there seems to be some overlap, so Royal Caribbean might even have a slight edge now.

In any case, there are some differences between the two lines that might or might not matter to you.

>> Royal Caribbean owns the largest ships on the seas and offers activities for the physically active like rock climbing walls and, on post-panamax ships, ice skating that you won't find on any other cruise line, including Princess. The line's newest ships also feature a "Royal Promenade" lined with shops that's an extension of the atrium and a center of activity.

>> Princess introduced the "Personal Choice Dining" program on all ships that have two or more main dining rooms, so passengers can choose between "Traditional Dining" with assigned tables at first and second seatings in one main dining room or "Anytime Dining" that operates like a restaurant ashore (you can either make a reservation or walk in whenever you wish to have dinner) in the other main dining room(s). All main dining rooms serve the same nightly menu and the evening dress code applies in all main dining rooms. Most other major cruise lines, including Royal Caribbean, offer only what Princess calls "Traditional Dining."

>> Princess fills swimming pools and hot tubs with fresh water. I understand that Royal Caribbean fills them with filtered sea water.

>> Royal Caribbean Cruises Ltd. (NYSE: RCL), the parent company of Royal Caribbean International, offers a url=http://media.corporate-ir.net/media_files/irol/10/103045/ShareholderBenefitLetter.pdf]shareholder benefit[/url]. Basically, anybody who submits booking details with proof of ownership of one hundred (100) or more shares of the parent company's common stock receives a shipboard credit between $50 and $250, depending upon the length of the cruise, that's fully combinable with all other offers and reusable on as many cruises as you take on either of the company's lines. I undertand that Carnival Corporation (NYSE: CCL) and Carnival Plc. (LSE: CCL), the parent companies of Princess Cruises, offer a similar benefit, but I don't know the details.

Have a wonderful cruise, whichever you decide!

Norm.
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Old December 6th, 2006, 06:47 PM
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Thanks Norm,
You were very informative which I greatly appreciated, I truly love Royal Caribbean cruise line, I like what they offer, however they only have the one ship, Adventure of the Seas that we just sailed in October, that goes Southern Caribbean and are looking to do Southern again and what to try a different cruise line
We also did southern caribbean five-years ago on Carnival Destiny, and they too only offer the one ship that goes there so I am not interested in sailing the same ships, like to try new adventures.

Thanks again
Jessie
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Old December 6th, 2006, 07:49 PM
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Quote:
, I'm hearing from many sources that Princess has moved to the bottom of the "premium" tier and that Royal Caribbean has moved to the top of the "mainstream" tier -- and there seems to be some overlap, so Royal Caribbean might even have a slight edge now
I'd have to disagree with Norm on this. I think Royal Caribbean offers a very good mass market experience, especially offering an cruise experience that is quickly becoming the most attractive experience for families. They do build beautiful ships, and the service is generally friendly... but often not all that polished.

Princess does offer a bit more of a "premium experience", with more polished service. Where I think Princess actually excels is with the entertainment onboard... and honestly one would expect RCI to the stronger in this department. The staggered schedule of entertainment throughout the ship works very well offering guests quite a selection of entertainment throughout the evening.

Though Princess "main" showrooms on the Grand Class ship, in my view are undersized... so if there's a show you really want to see there, you have to grab seats early. They try and deal with by using altermate show venues at the same time, and often repeating their most popular shows later in the cruise at a different time.
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Old December 6th, 2006, 08:07 PM
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Hi Jessie,

We haven't sailed with RCI (yet!), but we love Princess!

We enjoy the "Anytime Dining" because we don't like to be "stuck" with a specific time to eat at a specific place. On our last cruise (on Sun Princess) we sometimes ate in the dining room, sometimes in Verdi's Pizza, and sometimes in Horizon Court (buffet). Of course you can always book the Traditional Dining if that's what you prefer. If you want Traditional Dining you need to book early as it fills up very quickly!

We don't make use of the pools, but they are fresh water instead of salt water, which is important to some people.

The crew on both of our Princess cruises have been wonderful!

If you own 100 or more shares of Carnival Corp. you can get a $100.00 onboard credit (one per cabin).

IMHO, I think you'll enjoy cruising on Princess .
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Old December 7th, 2006, 01:38 AM
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I've sailed on both and find Princess much, much better. The food and service are so much better with Princess. Plus the fresh water pools ... and real fridges in the cabins (RCI has the mini bar kind where the ice melts almost immediately).

I've had friends who have recently travelled on RCI and said the food has really gone down hill ... and the service. I thought it had when I was last onboard with RCI. For example - a relatively minor thing, but important to me - you get a glass water at the beginning of the dinner BUT rarely did they refill it. Not the case with Princess - always keeping it full.

Princess not only offers you an excellent selection of entrees, etc. but also have standard things like shrimp cocktails, caesar salads, steaks that you can substitute every night if you wish. RCI made a big deal out of asking for shrimp cocktail if it weren't on the menu.

Lots of very athletic things to do on RCI like the rock climbing, ice skating, surfing ... on the other hand, no team trivia. Must say the ice skating show was very, very nice.

That shipboard credit really isn't worth it if you check out the cost of 100 shares of the stock.

On the other hand, if you book your next Princess cruise onboard for only a $100 deposit per person, you'll get that back as a shipboard credit if you[/size] book an outside cabin and don't have to pay the balance until final payment date - about 75 days out from the cruise. If you book an inside cabin, you'd get a $50 credit onboard for that $100 deposit.

The choice of Traditional Dining vs Personal Choice is really a great deal. Something for everyone. If you get Traditional dining you can do the Personal Choice but not the other way around.

I'd have to disagree with Norm, too, about RCI but then he has a vested interest in it being a stockholder and a former stockholder of Princess until Carnival bought them.

In my opinion, Carnival has pretty much left Princess alone which is great ... they do get cost savings by being able to buy for so many lines at special prices.

Recently I've been sailing on RCI's Celebrity line - which is nice ... however, I find it rather more expensive in many areas. A beer on Princess is $3.50 and on Celebrity $4.50 - both plus 15% gratuity.

The specialty coffees on both Princess and Celebrity cost extra ... more on Celebrity than Princess but both are excellent coffees. Dinner coffee is better on Princess.

Oh yes, if you're on your 6th sailing on either RCI or Princess, you'll get 10 free internet minutes on RCI/Celebrity (about the time it takes to sign on) and absolutely FREE internet on Princess. Made a note on my comment card this past April with Celebrity's Millie to do the same, but don't believe they have.

I heartedly recommend Princess ... enjoy whatever you take - how can you not, you'll be cruising!
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Old December 7th, 2006, 10:13 PM
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CruzNut,

Quote:
Originally Posted by You
That shipboard credit really isn't worth it if you check out the cost of 100 shares of the stock.
That depends how often, and for how long, you take cruises. If you take two paid cruises of ten days or more per year, you'll get at least $400 of shipboard credit. That works out to a return of nearly 10% that is not subject to income tax in addition to the quarterly dividend and, hopefully, appreciation in the stock price over the time that you hold your shares. YMMV, but please let me know if you find another investment vehicle that's guaranteed to do as well.

And here I most assuredly should add the usual disclaimers that telling people about the benefit does not constitute a solicitation to buy the stock, that the company's stock may or may not be a suitable investment in your particular situation, and that you should consult your accountant, your broker, and/or your personal financial advisor for advice tailored to your particular situation.

Norm.
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Old December 8th, 2006, 08:30 PM
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I agree with Norm!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Norm
If you take two paid cruises of ten days or more per year, you'll get at least $400 of shipboard credit. That works out to a return of nearly 10% that is not subject to income tax in addition to the quarterly dividend and, hopefully, appreciation in the stock price over the time that you hold your shares. YMMV, but please let me know if you find another investment vehicle that's guaranteed to do as well.
We bought Carnival stock as an investment, not as a way to get onboard credit. That's just a "perk" !

Owning Carnival stock will get you the OBC on any of the lines that Carnival owns. We just used ours on Sun Princess (11 days, balcony cabin) and got $100.00 OBC.

Before you buy any stock, be sure to read Norm's disclaimer, which applies to any investment!
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Old December 10th, 2006, 10:23 AM
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Jessie, All who have answered make valid points of comparison. We have sailed RCI many times and have just recently sailed our second cruise on Princess. We have found that our personal preference of late is with Princess, however, there are several caveats go with my statement.

First everyone naturally has different criterias in thier individual likes and dislikes. Second every ship even of the same line can differ in atmosphere, level of service and such. Finally even different cruises on the same ship can differ in levels of service, food, and entertainment. Often the itinerary can be a deciding factor both with passengers and crew.

In example, sailing a ship that is at the end of an itinerary that it has been sailing for several months can present a crew that has hit the level of boredom. Whereas a crew starting on a new itinerary can be revitalized by the newness of the sailing just as passengers would be. Levels of vendor's ability to supply foodstuffs can vary. Again fresh fruit might be far better sailing and stocking at a homeport where such is more available versus another where such items are imported from much farther away. Many variables make up any particular cruise so general statements of what to expect offered by anyone should be taken as meant, merely as guidance.

All that said I will offer my generalties concerning your question of RCI versus Princess. You will find my review of my last RCI sailing in November 2005 onboard Voyager of The seas from Bayonne here in the reader review section, and of our Crown Princess sailing this October from Brooklyn.

I have found that RCI has become far more family and mass market oriented than they were in the past. This can be viewed as a good thing if you fit the categorey of passenger that prefers a more theme park with the kids experience versus having a somewhat different experience that what might be a general American desire. Don't take that the wrong way, I do not mean it to be a critique of what we Americans look for. Had kids, loved the mass market theme park with family things back in the day. It is not where I am at now however so my point of view is derived from my requirements fo a cruise. Because of the more mass market appeal of cruising and such cruiselines have adpted thier product to US mainstream, rather than US mainstream coming to enjoy a different travel experience. Bad for me, good for many. Accent on fancy dining, food presentation, white glove service has diminished. Replaced with casual dining, casual service, and accepable food quality. Cruise booking prices have been lowered while onboard prices raised to offset booking revenue numbers. So in the end RCI is not what it was, but neither is Princess. For us Princess has changed slower so is currently our preferred line.

Personally I would make a selection by a varied criteria more than just RCI versus Princess.

Will you be going with kids?
Will you be sailing during a school break time?
Where will ship be sailing from and too?
What are prices during various time frames and am I locked into a specific time frame.
Looking for peace and quiet or active family adventure?

Prices for same cruise can vary considerably one week to another. A week that kids are off from school will be heavily booked and since business is one of supply and demand may have fewer discounted pricings. Whereas following week may be harder for line to book, hence may bring about large disounts. Crew service can also be affected. A full ship has same number of service staff as a less full ship so service ability is certainly impacted.

So my point being that some real homework coupled with what your preferences are has to figure into the equation more than simply one line versus another.

I wouldn't even put any stock ownership into the discussion as no one in thier righthmind would buy stock based upon a small onboard credit achieved. If I had stock in a line that I had decided to sail yes I ould take advantage of credit but it would not enter into the initial decision for me.
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Old December 10th, 2006, 07:48 PM
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After lots of cruises on both Princess, and RCI, I have to say that Princess gets the nod every time from me. I too disagree with Norm. I think the ships at RCI are nicer, and the service good, but in general, the RCI cruise can't hold a candle to the Princess cruise. It's nothing in particular, just so many little things that make a Princess cruise better for me. Entertainment aboard Princess is IMO much, much better than any other line I've ever sailed, and the food and service just a notch better too.
Have no fear, you'll enjoy your Princess cruise. I have no doubt at all!

Ken
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Old December 11th, 2006, 11:25 AM
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Just off the "Golden" last month and "Radiance" the month prior and although they were very similar, bookings are with "RCI" next year. Food and service seemed identical. Balcony for the mini-suite on "Golden" was a joke compared to a "JS" on "Radiance." I used to love that "Princess" had real hot chocolate in the dining room with my breakfast but it wasn't offered in any form this trip (as mentioned, the small differences DO add up).

Part of my formula is past performance too. With a half dozen "Princess" cruises and about triple that with "RCI," "Princess" had one bad cruise and one TERRIBLE charter arrangement out of Tahiti. "RCI" has damaged a piece of luggage and overcharged me by $50 and made me jump through hoops to get it back. But by comparison, "Princess" will be waiting a bit for my business.
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Old December 25th, 2006, 01:14 PM
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As a long time cruise fams we have sailed RCI and Princess ships for many years to many different destinations. Given that food is my single biggest concern, between these two ships, Princess gets the nod. I find the RCI ships very attractive and "light" and comfortable. We no longer sail with our kids and find RCI to me more acvtive and tend to appeal more to kid/family vacation than Princess.
Celebrity gets most of our cruise dollars with Princess coming in second. The mega class ships of RCI just don't fit our personalized style and service that the Celebrity and smaller Princess ships offer.
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Old December 31st, 2006, 08:19 PM
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I guess it depends on why you cruise - we really enjoy the chance to dress up and think there is nothing so nice as the formal dinner where it takes ones back to the time when everyone dressed for dinner and the dining room looked so grand and glamorous. However we sailed onthe Legend of the Seas and would not sail again on the Royal Caribbean as there was no glamour there. In the dining room there was jeans and shorts permitted and even on the formal nights there were people in shorts and jeans - this would never be allowed on a Princess vessel. This was the tackiest vessel we have sailed on and it seems the staff was just too afraid to upset the passengers and therefore there was no supervision either on deck where children ran around at all hours or in enforcing the dress code. We will take Princess over Royal Caribbean anytime.
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Old January 1st, 2007, 07:00 PM
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Just done a back to back Jewel of the Seas followed by Caribbean Princess.
We have done 2 previous cruises with each company.
I deliberately have not read any previous posts so here are my initial thoughts.
The winner is RCI, which is a change from our previous impressions.
The RCI ships are better.
The RCI food is better overall.
The Princess food is hotter (unless you gripe your RCI waiter)
The RCI coffee is better.
The Princess entertainment is better.
The Princess bread is better but the RCI pastries are better.
The pools on the larger Princess ships are better then RCI.
The RCI gym's are better.
Princess was cheaper than RCI.
The embarkation on RCI was better however express disembarkation on Princess was brilliant.
More people on RCI seemed to use the hand sanitizers than on Princess.
Butter and jams are served in individual sealed packets on RCI whereas they are bulk on Princess.
More formal on Princess.
Just my opinion - standing ready to be blasted!
Mr M
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Old January 2nd, 2007, 01:26 AM
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It's been about three years since we've been on RCI, so I can't really do a fair comparison, except to say that when we were on RCI last, we were pleasantly surprised at the overall quality of the cruise.

What I can say is that in my opinion, Princess is on a downhill slide. Last year's 14-day crossing on Golden left much to be desired, and my specific review is in the reader reviews section of this site. There were problems with most aspects of the cruise, none of them hugely serious, but all of them annoying. We've been sailing on Princess and her predecessors since 1976, and it's clear to us that Carnival has indeed been cutting corners with the Princess brand, and rather seriously.

We're giving Princess one more chance this spring, mostly because we're visiting friends in Texas and they want to take a short cruise. They're first-timers, and the only run that's convenient for them happens to be a week on Princess out of Galveston. It'll be interesting to see whether anything's improved. We've been on both Celebrity and Oceania in the months since Princess.

And a word about perks for shareholders. In my opinion, there is only one reason to own the stock of any company: you believe it will fulfill your investment objectives. Letting other considerations influence your buying decision is unwise, quite simply because these ancillary considerations will tend to cloud your judgment about when it is time to sell. Any successful individual stock investment ultimately involves two decisions--a buy and a sell--and both must be right in order for the investment to attain maximum success. If you form an attachment to a security for reasons other than the ongoing performance of the company, you'll be less likely to pull the trigger at the right time. Just an opinion from an investor of 45 years standing, whose only investment rewards have been the rewards of the market, and who wouldn't have it any other way.
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Old January 2nd, 2007, 07:48 PM
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AR,

Quote:
Originally Posted by You
And a word about perks for shareholders. In my opinion, there is only one reason to own the stock of any company: you believe it will fulfill your investment objectives. Letting other considerations influence your buying decision is unwise, quite simply because these ancillary considerations will tend to cloud your judgment about when it is time to sell. Any successful individual stock investment ultimately involves two decisions--a buy and a sell--and both must be right in order for the investment to attain maximum success. If you form an attachment to a security for reasons other than the ongoing performance of the company, you'll be less likely to pull the trigger at the right time. Just an opinion from an investor of 45 years standing, whose only investment rewards have been the rewards of the market, and who wouldn't have it any other way.
I agree completely, but with one caveat. You have to include value that you derive from a "shareholder benefit," including the fact that it is not taxable, in your calculatoin of return on investment (ROI). In found figures, if you buy 100 shares of a cruise company's stock at $40/share ($4,000 invested) and you receive $400/year in shareholder benefits (two cruises of ten to eleven days each year, for example), you have a tax free return of 10% in addition to your dividends and, hopefully, appreciation of capital. The dividends and appreciation of capital also can be tax free if you hold the shares through a Roth IRA or some other tax-free account. For most people who take a couple cruises per year on either company's cruise lines, the shareholder benefit is enough to make the first hundred shares of stock in either Carnival Corporation (NYSE: CCL) or Royal Caribbean Cruises Ltd. (NYSE: RCL) more attractive than many other stocks. Unfortuntely, the shareholder benefits don't produce any returns on odd lots or on shares in excess of one hundred.

I believe that the cruise industry will continue to grow at an impressive pace for the foreseeable future, so I my holding is much larger than one hundred shares. Nonetheless, there may be other opportunities available that will yield even stronger returns than this industry.

And here I should add the usual diclaimers (1) that discussion of the shareholder benefit is for informational purposes only and does not constitute a solicitation to buy shares in any cruise company, (2) that cruise company stocks are not necessarily an appropriate investment for all readers of this board, and (3) that readers of this board should do their own due dilligence before investing and should consult their own financial advisors for advice tailored to their financial situations.

Norm.
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