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  #1 (permalink)  
Old November 1st, 2003, 12:45 PM
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Default I don't get it?????????????

I don't understand what the big deal is about tipping?? In B.C, Canada, our minimum wage is 8$ an hour and we *****? Generally canadians tip way to little!!! ( I am canadian just in case i might offend someone) We just came back from Our holiday and found out that in texas for example, someone in the hospitality industry only makes 2.13$ an hour, he needs his tips to live!!!! The service in the states is way better than anything you will find in canada!! When you are budgeting for a holiday you should really include the tips also!! You wouldn't have such a great experience without all the workers who take care of you!!
When we where on our cruise, we asked one of the Bar servers what she makes? ( we wanted to be nosey) she told us 45$ a month??? Whether this was true or not, they still work for there tips!!!
The best way for all the people who are having trouble understanding tipping, should actually do a hospitality job for a week!! Then lets here what you have to say!!!!
Cheers,
captangel

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Old November 1st, 2003, 04:17 PM
pg. pg. is offline
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Default Re: I don't get it?????????????

captangel , I am Canadian , I have worked on a hospitally job for MANY years. You can't compare apples to oranges, an Amercian earns minimum wage based on their states standard of living( cost of living) what 2 dollars buys their is more than what 2 dollars buys here.
I totally disagree with you on the level of service provided here, may-be where you work that is the norm but I've always worked in nice places where the moral was good and we would bend over backwards to treat our customers well.
I've also experienced good and bad service in many places in Canada and in the States' MANAGEMENT and STAFF MORALE seem to be the important points.If staff like their jobs and are treated with respect by each other and mangement then generally the service in those sorts of places is good, I don't think it has ANYTHING to do with which country an establishment is located

P.S. Skinny people are not all miserable, what a generalization, that's like saying all fat people are"jolly" .
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Old November 1st, 2003, 04:31 PM
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Default Re: I don't get it?????????????

We are all Jolly!!! You guys are always on diets!!!
My point is that tipping is a nice jesture for good service! I to work in a 5 star restaurant and have also worked in the industry for MANY years!
Tipping is a subject like religion----we all have our own ideas and opinions!!
I believe good service warrants a tip!
cheers,
captangel

PS. stop dieting you seem agitated!!

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Old November 1st, 2003, 06:48 PM
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Default Re: I don't get it?????????????

"the service in the states is way better than anything you will find in canada" umm did you actually read my post?
On another post you claim we should DOUBLE the tax to figure out a tip. Since our tax is 14% your position is that we should tip 28 % .I believe the "norm" would be 15 to 20%
so apparently you feel everyone should be a "big " tipper.
I tip, I always tip the approiate amount, but your post was rather derogatory to Canadains, whether or not you are in fact one yourself.
As a Canadian who has worked in the hospitality business I can assure that MY tips were usaully very good thank you very much, of course perhaps that has not been your experience. I am aware that some nationalities either do not tip( as it is not the custom in their country) or do not tip well. I usally can forgive them that, having traveled to serveral countries outside of North American I am aware that not every countries customs are as ours.
Perhaps if you reread the posts about tipping you will find that MOST people do in fact tip, that they are often just concerned about who to tip what, and that some people do not have the means to tip excessively( over 20%) It doesn't make them bad people, so what don't you understand about that?
P.S. Not dieting ,eating peanut butter toast right now and pigging out on my kids Halloween candy, yum!
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Old November 2nd, 2003, 01:17 AM
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Default Re: I don't get it?????????????

I guess i just didn't state it properly,
my point is that 15 ti 20% is a good tip and that people should tip for good service!
You should eat somemore candy and sweeten up!!!! I am out here and this board!!
one person is allowed to say something and the other person gets condemed!! I guess i am not a very good writer!!???
chow you alll
see you on a cruise!!!!
BYE BYE

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Old November 2nd, 2003, 01:29 AM
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Default Re: I don't get it?????????????

Wow, is it always this testy on these boards??
Maybe everyone should just stop and think? I did't get all that out of the posts!
tipping is a privledge! I run a restaurant, I see what the wait staff make! I think that you get what you deserve. Being a server no matter where you live ( US, Canada, Europe....etc.) is an very hard job. It takes a special person to do this job! If you love it you probably do well, if you are just doing it because.....you probably make less!
I thought these boards where for advice and information???
From what I have learnt, tipping stands for
T-to
I-insure
P-prompt
S-service
Am I wrong??
I am new to these boards and am hoping to get some fair and non-violent feed back!!
ibcruzin
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Old November 2nd, 2003, 01:35 AM
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Default Re: I don't get it?????????????

Ibcruzin,, No you are not wrong, that is the correct meaning of T.I.P.S. and I tend to agree with your post.
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Old November 2nd, 2003, 01:57 AM
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Default Re: I don't get it?????????????

pg,
I am also from Canada, actually from British Columbia, I think what cptangl was trying to say under that anger was that in B.C our total tax in the restaurants is 7 % on meals and 17% tax on liqour . ( I think this person needs to learn to communicate a little better!
My Waiters and Waitresses make an average of 80$ Cdn. after tip out and I make them tip the support staff 2% of there ring out. They must be happy my shortest time I have had a server on staff is 3 years! She is the new staff!!! My Supervisor has been with me for 18 years and refuses to not take a section! She insists on taking tables, and she has a full section everynight she works! As soon as we get greedy waitress/ers they pretty much never last long! They do not have enough personality to do the job with respect and ablity!
ibcruzin
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Old November 2nd, 2003, 03:23 PM
pg. pg. is offline
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Default Re: Re: I don't get it?????????????

Ibcruzin, agreed, good staff, good tips. I feel most people do tip properly if treated well. on land and at sea.!
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Old November 4th, 2003, 12:24 PM
allis154
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Default Re: Re: Re: I don't get it?????????????

I wonder if my view on tipping is different from everyone elses. I don't tip for medicore service. If it is really bad, then I tip a penny or a nickel. If it is great service, then I tip a lot. I once tipped $35 for $80 meal, the service was unbelievable. I know that most will hollar at this, but this is the way we do it.

I know that some companies say that tipping is part of your salary, but I for one don't belive that it should be. You should be paid sufficently, and tips come as extra. Mandatory tipping (like what is one cruise lines) is asking the passengers to pay for the salaries. I would rather have that included in the cruise fare and have the staff paid what the are worth, not the bare minimum.

Oh, as to those in the service industry in Canada, are you aware that your tips are classed as income and you should be declaring it on your income tax forms?
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Old November 4th, 2003, 12:53 PM
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Default Re: I don't get it?????????????

Allis154, Yes aware about the tax on tips, also aware that 90% of service workers under declare their tips, sometimes unintentionally, mostly intentionally. They often come out ahead of the average non tip worker. On a good night a server( in a nice place) can tip out about 100 to 125 $ they then depending on where they work tip out a % to their bussers and sometimes even the kitchen staff! This is a bone of contention for many because kitchen staff do not get audited for tip income ( since they are not considered to be recieving tips) where as waiters and busers often do. Still a waiter/waitress can add to their income substantially by underdeclaring , it is a process that occures a little at a time, recieve 100 dollars , tip out 15 to 20 dollars, now instead of declaring 80 dollars , declare 50, viola, 30 dollars straight into the pocket tax free.!! Now mulitp;y that by all the shifts a server who works full time and you can come out way ahead of the guy working in a no tip job, even if the wage may be slightly higher!

I wonder who the cruise personal declare their tips to, do they pay any tax? To what country? Interesting point isn't it?
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Old November 4th, 2003, 08:53 PM
anita kennedy
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Default Re: Re: I don't get it?????????????

I believe in tipping. I tip even if the service wasn't something to write home about, say you go to a Applebee and you have to ask your waiter twice for things or whatever. Then they get the 10% tip. If I don't have to ask for anything and they come back they I just double the tax. (tax here is 9%) so it works about more than 15% It's very easy to do that way, tax on 30.00 tab is 2.70 double is 5.40, 15% of 30 is 4.50 so they get about $1 more. Most are college students and I have had some of those in my house, they need their extra money to help pay some of their expeses.

I don't care if they report their tips or not, its none of my business. Hats off to them if they get away with anything. Most probably don't make enough to to file income tax here.

On the ships I also don't care if they report their tips or not. I'm not exactaly in love with paying taxes myself and it certainly doesn't keep me from having anythihg if I give a few dollars more. If that were the case I would not be eating out or cruising. I would be working working and paying Uncle Sam. I don't see what the big deal is over how much to tip anywhere. Tip what you think it is worth. If you are a lousey tipper, they will remember you...
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Old November 5th, 2003, 01:08 PM
pg. pg. is offline
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Default Re: I don't get it?????????????

So you tip for lousy service? Why?

I tip well for good service , lousy service gets lousy ( or no ) tips. Real simple.
And by the way some of those servers make more then MANY people who are the working poor of our nations. If you've been reading the boards you will see they can make between 1000 and 1800 US dollars a month and they get free room and board. NOW I KNOW they work for it, good, because they make more than lots of people I know.

As for the college student angle , they need to learn tha good work is rewarded and poor work is not , JUST LIKE IN REAL LIFE!

I will repeat myself once more just so everyone gets this, I DO TIP<, i just don't tip for lousy service PERIOD. ( and I have served for years and could make excellant tips thank you very much)
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Old November 5th, 2003, 06:50 PM
anita kennedy
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Default Re: Re: I don't get it?????????????

Golly I felt like I was getting a fussing at for stating my pratice on tipping. To set the record straight I did not say I tipped for lousy service. Guess I have never had lousy service or am easier to please than most. However I don't consider 1800 a month a lot of money to live on and I also don't consider a persons salary when rewarding them for a job well done. If that were the case I woul dnot eat out as restaurants make a good profit and I would be offended in paying for the food if I didn't want them to get richer.

Give me a break I only stated my pratice on tipping.
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Old November 5th, 2003, 07:55 PM
pg. pg. is offline
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Default Re: I don't get it?????????????

Anita , I 'm sorry you felt I was giving you a fussing?I guess we feel different about things, that 's ok but believe me 1800 a month is not bad for a waiter, when I convert that into Canadain then it seems astronomical. Keep in mind thats with room and board .
I took your post to mean you tipped for bad service because I felt that if I went out and had to ask for things twice that I wasn't getting good service. I know see that although that is not "lousy " service , it would't qualify for as decent service either.
I may be a bit defensive because unlike some posters who seem to have a lot of money( to us) we don't and we HAVE to watch each penny. We still tip but we can't afford to be frivolus about it. I have worked for years in a "tip " job so I problay do have high expectations ,I give excellant service( or darn well try to ) and I expect others to try hard too. Sorry and Happy cruising!
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Old November 5th, 2003, 08:07 PM
anita kennedy
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Default Re: Re: I don't get it?????????????

Thanks for clearing that up. I guess we do differ but we don't go out a lot and when I do I find that it I didn't have to cook it and if I don't have to do the dishes it is worth something at least the minum. I look at it as part of the bill. Glad you give good service and from what I have read most Canadians don't tip well, sorry for that. It is a hard job to do being on your feet and trying to please so many people in the public. Some expect to be waited on hand and feet. Glad I am not like that so I should be a good customer.
Good luck to you and hope you get a cruise also soon. I won't get one until June of 2005. Oh how is the cost of living in Canada? Like how much is a loaf of bread?
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Old November 6th, 2003, 12:38 AM
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Default Re: I don't get it?????????????

Anita, The cost of everything varies dramatically depending on where you live ( just like the states) . I am on the west coast , a house (3- 4 bedroom 2-3 bath say 2000 sq feet) in a middle class area (in a bigger city) can be anywhere from 200,000 to 500.000. In a small town or rural area you could get the same thing for 120,000 to 200,000.
A loaf of bread can be cheap $1.00 or go up to $3.00 ( depends on kind and place) .
The minimum wage is $ 8.00 an hour. In a city like Vancouver there are many homes over the multi million dollar mark.
Most young people have to move out to the outlying districts to afford homes( unless they were lucky and got in the market before 1990).
Some things are probaly the same as many parts of the states, it's hard to compare because of the difference in the dollar. American dollars kill us, and every single cruise line in the world( or so it seems) is priced in American dollars even if it's not an American company that owns it, and even if it never docks in Amercia.
The average income of a middle class family is from 50,000 to 75,000 a year. Keep in mind the prices of homes and you'll see how the dollars flow out one hand . Milk is about $3.50 a gallon( but it can be as little as $3.15 at Costco or as much as $4.30 in a corner store).
A glass of wine in a nice pub- 4 to 5 dollars.
A beer $3.50 to 4dollars.
And I am "retired" now ( 3 kids) but I loved working with the public and understood the value of the dollar they were paying and so I tryed to treat them like gold.I actually really like chatting with people and having them happy. So that 's probaly why I don't tolerate half hearted service.I do like being served though, can't wait till April on the Golden!!
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Old November 6th, 2003, 08:46 AM
anita kennedy
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Default Re: Re: I don't get it?????????????

p.g. Thanks for answering my questions. We sound comprable except min wage is higher. I hope you have a very good time on your april cruise. I enjoyed hearing about your country and your views. I totally understand your views now.
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Old November 6th, 2003, 10:55 AM
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Default Re: I don't get it?????????????

Mind if I put in my 1 cent here?

When I go into a restaurant for dinner, I go in with the mindset of tipping 20% of the bill. Then I start to deduct points when service is less than stellar. Great service, which should be the minimum, gets 20%. Forget to refill my drink............deduct 3%. Bring me a baked potato instead of fries as I ordered.............deduct 2%. Make me wait an extra long time to pay my bill...........deduct 3%. And so on.

I've only deducted the entire 20% once in my life. That was done when a friend and I had travelled 1200 miles by car and we finally reached our destination and pulled into a nicer restaurant for dinner before we checked into our hotel to get cleaned up. We were probably a bit disheveled and wearing wrinkled clothing. The waitress took one look at us and told us before we ever looked at a menu that 15% tip was standard and expected in this place. We had a bill between the two of us over $100. I told her kindly before we left the two of us were in the restaurant business and well aware of tipping guidelines and our system of 20% and then points deducted. Had to inform her that her prejudging of us and her feeling it necessary to let us know the expectation was way out of line and cause for the entire 20% deduction.

Regards,
Thomas
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Old November 6th, 2003, 03:34 PM
anita kennedy
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Default Re: Re: I don't get it?????????????

That is quite clever, I don't know if I would have stayed to eat if I got the feeling I was beingjudged.
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Old November 7th, 2003, 10:08 AM
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Default Re: I don't get it?????????????

Thomas, how rude of that waitress! I really like your idea of starting at 20% and then deducting for errors.
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Old November 7th, 2003, 10:15 AM
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Default Re: I don't get it?????????????


Pg, It seems that we both live in the beautiful west coast. We also have a 6.00$ beginners wage, this wage is for people who have never claimed a paycheck before,
someone who has never worked before. Mostly for students just starting out in the work force.( more like a training wage) After they complete 500 hours of work they go up to 8$. In the hospitality industry right now we are battling with new Liqour laws, non- smoking, and the fact that no one really wants to work hard for there wage anymore!
Non-smoking laws are great! unfortunaltly It has made some people angry!
The liqour laws on the other hand are just plain stupid, and we really need to have the
"new rules" properly published!
When I am on a cruise, my first thought is always, can I please bring my servers home with me! all of them!!
I have always taken home new tricks and a new attitude, after being served in the dinning rooms!! So much fun! They love there jobs, or pretend to!! I guess its there job!
I love what I do to! I really hate that tipping is such a hot topic!
ibcruzin
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Old November 22nd, 2003, 03:16 PM
wallie5446
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Default Re: I don't get it?????????????

Once again if the Lines, Restaurants, and any service intry business would just raise their prices to pre-cover gratuity that would settle this. Then only the well off could afford to go anywhere let alone on a cruise. Tip is a slang and the real term is Gratuity, which is a reward for something well done.
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