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  #61 (permalink)  
Old January 6th, 2005, 03:21 AM
Bruce Chafkin
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Default Re: what if you just don't tip

Gilmer,

Quite a few of Americas top restaurants also pool tips. And quite often, the kitchen staff, bakers, dishwashers do get a cut. It encourages a team spirit in getting the job done and the guest satisfied. It works the same way on many of todays cruise ships.

Gerif makes the faulty reasoning that staff who know they will not make more than their standard cut will not work any harder than necessary. That is rarely the case. Take a look at the history of cruise ship tipping. I started working on ships in 1974. We pooled tips then - but we learned quickly not to tell you about it . As soon as you found out, the tip pool total went down. We let you believe that we kept all that money in the envelope you gave us.
We always knew we were going to get our cut of the tipping pool - whether you tipped or not. It is the same today. But if we were good enough to convince - or shame you - into tipping, we ALL made even more. And although we have ALWAYS pooled the tips amongst ourselves, there are many many opportunities to earn a bit more "on the side" with a bit of fancy dancing.

Since 1974 I have pooled tips on:
Royal Viking Ships
Some Holland America Ships
Renaissance Ships
Costa Ships
Royal Caribbean Ships
Royal Cruise Line Ships
Carnival Ships
NCL Ships
Celebrity Ships

The only thing that has really changed with tipping in recent years is that the quality of the average cruiser has declined with lower cruise prices. Todays cruiser just doesnt have as much money as those in the good old days of cruising - and the average tip recommended and given by guests has been declining for years. Do you think that may have something to do with a perceived decline in service?
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  #62 (permalink)  
Old January 7th, 2005, 01:43 AM
pg
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Default Re: what if you just don't tip

Thomas, please, come to my city, Victoria BC. Go into any decent restauarant here, the serivice will undoubtlby be good. And we pay our servers a set minimun wage.Tips are expected, but 10 to 15 % is normal. Tipping 20% would mark you as a :"big tipper" or an American!(lol)
Saying you think service is better with the low wage thing just isn't true, service is an art taught, and expected, in any real tourist town.

PS Raisng your food prices to pay a higher wage would hurt you because some other restaurant would undercut you, and you would lose business. Trust me, people would just eat out less. As it is the system you have in place works for you.

I've said it before and I will say it again, we Canadians are not cheap, you Americans have just gone tip crazy. There is NO other country in the WHOLE world that tips the way you guys do.!!

I have to agree with Tokyo Rose on one thing. Reens post was catty and unnecesary.
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  #63 (permalink)  
Old January 25th, 2005, 09:37 AM
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Default Re: what if you just don't tip

What I said is tipping is incentive based pay. I stand by that.

You say service in your city will be undoubtedly good, and you have a tipping system there.

I'm glad you agree.

Regards,
Thomas
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  #64 (permalink)  
Old January 27th, 2005, 09:34 PM
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Default Re: what if you just don't tip

Cmon people I asked this question 6 months ago when I was in the planing stages to go on a cruise. I went on my cruise got pre paid gratuties and the people were so great I gave them something extra. Let this subject be pushed way down to the bottom who gives a **** about ToykoRose anyway. Can one of the moderators delete this topic? This is all old news.

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  #65 (permalink)  
Old January 28th, 2005, 04:42 PM
pg. pg. is offline
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Default Re: what if you just don't tip

jphc318
Cheap people may suck, but if you had read all of TRs posts then they might have clued in that TR is not a male. You also should know that name calling is not allowed on this board, and changing one letter does not change the language you used.
Put your point across without swearing, because quite frankly swearing puts you beneath " cheap people" on my "class o'meter. "
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  #66 (permalink)  
Old January 29th, 2005, 12:52 PM
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Default Re: what if you just don't tip

I don't know if this will help any of you that are frustrated with TR's posts or not, but I figured out a long time ago that she clings fiercely to bad information in order to support her position. She constantly talks about the cruiselines "paying a good wage" without being able to support her position. Kuki and many others who know lots and lots of cruiseline staff say otherwise.

When we were on our last cruise, our waiter voluntarily talked with us about his life - including his wages. He made a base salary of $50 per month and depended on tips for the rest of his income.

I would have tipped him no matter what, but if the person's wage is your standard, then know you are part of his wage - the cruiselines are certainly not paying a living wage.

dorothy

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  #67 (permalink)  
Old January 31st, 2005, 04:19 AM
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Default Re: what if you just don't tip

>>>She constantly talks about the cruiselines "paying a good wage" without being able to support her position. Kuki and many others who know lots and lots of cruiseline staff say otherwise.<<<

Read into the 1988 lawsuit filed against RCCL by a former employee. In court it came out that the employee was suing for lost wages due to an injury. Court documents state that RCCL paid a gaurantee of $788 of base and gratuities a month. This was in 1988. Meaning if the employee did not make at least $788, RCCL would make up the difference. They are also "paid" in the form of room and board.

>>>When we were on our last cruise, our waiter voluntarily talked with us about his life - including his wages. He made a base salary of $50 per month and depended on tips for the rest of his income. <<<

Of course he is going to tell you some sob story. He wants to guilt you into tipping him more. Not me, I feel no guilt. They are not forced to work for the cruiseline by any stretch of the imagination.

Back to the original poster, nothing is going to happen to you if you don't tip. The lines on which I cruise do not automatically add a service charge per day to your shipboard account, believe me if they did I would be there on the first day they appeared complaining about such service charge.
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  #68 (permalink)  
Old January 31st, 2005, 10:56 AM
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Default Re: what if you just don't tip

People as I said I got my question answered, went on my cruise and had my tips paid for by travelocity and tipped more because they did such a good job. I will always pre-pay my tips because it is one less thing thing to think abot when you count your money at the end. End of story thatn you very much, the fat lady has sung, and Elvis has left the building.

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  #69 (permalink)  
Old February 1st, 2005, 10:57 AM
LKL
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Default Re: what if you just don't tip

Well, Donald White, apparently other people still want to talk about this subject. Just because you started it doesn't mean that you can stop it.

I do tip, but I resent it, and I'll tell you why. Restaurants, cruise ships and any other place where it is "customary" to tip, should pay their employees a decent wage. I would rather see these wages reflected in the price of a meal or a cruise than to be hounded and nickeled and dimed to death. Let's get it out in the open. It's all the same in the end and I don't have to worry about it. I abhor the ugliness of having someone on a cruise telling me a sob story about how many hours, how hard they work and how little they are paid. I'm on vacation. I don't want to feel guilty. I feel guilty all the time as it is. I don't want to screw with envelopes and going to the purser's desk for cash to put in them, then having to run down and "bestow" them on some poor soul in the grand manner of a benefactor.

And another thing. When someone is clearly working for tips, they tend to badger you at poolside. I have been run off the deck before because as many as five different bar waiters were constantly interupting while I tried to meditate or read. And I hate it when I step out of my room for fifteen minutes and come back and my room is being straightened for the twentieth time. I want good service, but I also want unobtrusive service.

I'm always nice, I always tip, but I find it annoying.
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  #70 (permalink)  
Old February 1st, 2005, 12:53 PM
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Default Re: Re: what if you just don't tip

I really believe that if the cruise lines added the cost of tips into the cruise fare, the price charged would be more than it is now when you add the tips you pay to the cruise price. Then, I feel, you would be expected to tip al little on top of it.

TR, will you stop cruising completely when all the lines start adding the tip cost to your sign and sail accounts as a service charge?

I cruise, I tip, what more can I say.
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  #71 (permalink)  
Old February 2nd, 2005, 10:19 PM
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Default Re: what if you just don't tip

>>Of course he is going to tell you some sob story. He wants to guilt you into tipping him more. Not me, I feel no guilt. They are not forced to work for the cruiseline by any stretch of the imagination.>>

It wasn't a sob story and he never implied he was "forced to work". I don't feel guilt. I just simply know to behave and do.

Curious about that lawsuit, TR. Do you have a case name? I'd like very much to look it up on my dh's Westlaw account and read the whole case. Was it a federal case? If so, I assume it was filed in Florida.

dorothy



Post Edited (02-02-05 22:21)
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  #72 (permalink)  
Old February 4th, 2005, 10:22 AM
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Default Re: what if you just don't tip

"I really believe that if the cruise lines added the cost of tips into the cruise fare, the price charged would be more than it is now when you add the tips you pay to the cruise price. Then, I feel, you would be expected to tip al little on top of it."...........PaulB


I agree with Paul.

Regards,
Thomas
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  #73 (permalink)  
Old February 5th, 2005, 12:07 PM
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Default Re: what if you just don't tip

Yes... Paul B is correct on this one.. It would cost more and the extra tipping would start all over again.. OM
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  #74 (permalink)  
Old February 10th, 2005, 05:25 PM
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Default Re: what if you just don't tip

Just had to add... Toyrose and anyone else who doesnt tip servers at least 15%...no matter the cost of the meal when the service is at least as expected... bigger tip if service is superior.. is a cheap skate. Period, plain and simple. Trust me when you frequent a place it takes TWO times for the whole staff to know you don't tip or tip low. If I served a 3 course meal and it came to 100$ and I got less than 15$, next time I wait on you, we will have prepared a very special sauce for you in the back of the house that will accompany every thing you eat.

So, don't tip, we servers need a laugh almost as much as we need the cash, you cheap stinkers.
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  #75 (permalink)  
Old February 11th, 2005, 02:51 PM
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Default Re: what if you just don't tip

I doubt that Rose frequents the same restaurant.
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  #76 (permalink)  
Old February 11th, 2005, 09:36 PM
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Default Re: what if you just don't tip

Let me tell you something that may happen to you if you don't tip. Unknown to you your waiter or waitress might spit in your food or flick a nice little booger in it, I speak from personal knowledge as I had a friend who was a waiter and used to get even with people who were rude or non tipper, you would never know it and who knows what you might be ingesting. It is not worth the risk of getting hepatis A , or some other nasty disease. So non tipper's need to to think about possible consequences!
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  #77 (permalink)  
Old February 17th, 2005, 08:40 AM
Reen
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Default Re: what if you just don't tip

I agree on tipping. But, to spit in one's food or put a booger protein is really disgusting. I guess they would never be caught doing this awful thing. I would hope they would be fired and pay a heavy fine. Yuck!
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  #78 (permalink)  
Old February 21st, 2005, 05:48 PM
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Default Re: what if you just don't tip

how do they know whos soup to spit in? since the tip is at the end of the meal?
i tip as i like. i dont feel sorry for the crew, it is their decision to work where ever they can. and its not my responsiblity to finance their lives. by the way.... is meals are paid for , what is the 15% of?
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  #79 (permalink)  
Old February 25th, 2005, 07:18 AM
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Default Re: what if you just don't tip

The 15% tip is on the bar drinks.

Regards,
Thomas
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  #80 (permalink)  
Old March 3rd, 2005, 04:10 PM
Bob Bigg
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Default Re: Re: what if you just don't tip

Have to agree with Alaskan Pilot tips are completely out of hand. Just read that the doorman at the Waldorf with tips makes $400 per day. Wonder how much a NYC fireman made in tips at the WTC. My last cruise I couldn't get waited on so went to the bar myself and was still charged 15%. This was on NCL Sydney to Auckland.
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  #81 (permalink)  
Old March 13th, 2005, 05:35 AM
Nic
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Default Re: what if you just don't tip

Yikes- AM I I to beleive what I jusy walked inro ? A tipping sh&t storm. I have this down to a clasp. whoever doesnt likke the tipping araingment can go to where they love you , i.e. MC' D's is a possibility. You can verbally abuse them there ( and get sued ))

If you dont like it dont bite it- don't come in - read me all tourists and everyon else. That is all people who do not like it . Otherwise , shall I hire your weak little cousin from %^& to wash the dishes? Do you think the job pool is so great ,? maybe in bumf789 it is but not here in LOS ANGelos> WE have to treat our employees with great respect if you think you want your bum rubbed you must pay for the great servive you receive and expect when you ship into to town. don't get me started on the so= called Benefits...

PS . We have families , too.
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  #82 (permalink)  
Old March 13th, 2005, 05:46 AM
nic
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Default Re: what if you just don't tip

oh and Mr Big - what about the price of rent there baby, ever think og that> ? BOB? could it be hire than where you live an perhaps 400, is different than yours?
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  #83 (permalink)  
Old March 13th, 2005, 09:56 AM
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Default Re: what if you just don't tip

Nic I could barely understand your post, appparently besides a different sort of job market , LA also has a different sort of language.
I really don't get 50% of your lingo, but, the part I understand seems to say" don't go out if you don't tip", is that correct?

BTW, Most Alaskan pilots love their job and love living in Alaska( my uncle was a bush pilot for many , many years) and would not leave to live somewhere cheaper regardless. They do make a crap load of money, and they love doing you tourists! Ha Ha, keep on tipping .
I would NEVER compare an Alaskan pilot with a dishwasher, which btw, when is the last time you tippped a dishwasher.?
Dishwashers make crappy money and the work is hard and dirty.
Alaskan pilots love their job, often own their own planes, and their work is decently paid.
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  #84 (permalink)  
Old March 13th, 2005, 09:14 PM
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Default Re: what if you just don't tip

Dang Nic, move that towel off that deck chair an have a seat dude before your blood pressure goes through the roof & be sure to tip when they bring you a bud
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  #85 (permalink)  
Old March 14th, 2005, 12:30 PM
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Default Re: what if you just don't tip

I even tried reading Nic's post in Ahhnuld-speak, and couldn't make heads nor tails out of it.

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  #86 (permalink)  
Old March 15th, 2005, 08:46 AM
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Default Re: what if you just don't tip

When we visited in Ireland and added the tip to our credit slip, they would cross it out.
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  #87 (permalink)  
Old March 22nd, 2005, 04:02 AM
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Default Re: what if you just don't tip

The cruise company should pay proper wages to all employees, then correct taxes etc would be paid.

Obviously this would result in increased tour prices but it would end all arguments about tipping which would only happen for service above the norm.

The current situation is ridiculous with us having to study the small print to work out how much a cruise will cost us.

Who can justify adding 15% for drinks we get ourself at the bars, or tipping for room service that they claim is free 24/7.

Waiters jobs are to serve and cleaners to clean why should they expect extra for ordinary service ?
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  #88 (permalink)  
Old March 22nd, 2005, 12:56 PM
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Default Re: what if you just don't tip

John here is an idea if you don't like it don't cruise. The cruiselines aren't desperate for your business. If you don't think it is worth it someone else will.
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  #89 (permalink)  
Old March 22nd, 2005, 04:49 PM
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Default Re: what if you just don't tip

Donald White Jr..................Please go read the post "Tipping",
it can be found under the "cruise line" postings catagory, in the "Royal Caribbean" file.
That may or may not open your eyes to the importance of tipping!
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  #90 (permalink)  
Old March 25th, 2005, 09:40 PM
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Default Re: what if you just don't tip

Mom I guess you didn't read all that I wrote. I bought my cruise through Travelocity that I went on 5 months ago and they pre paid my tips. I don't know why I did the subject but I did anyway 5 months late I am glad you gave me your insight.

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