OK I'll say it and take the weight for it. Cruiselines have come more and more in line with mass market standard American vacation complete with fast food and cut off jeans. This because they have increased ship size since it is more profitable for a passenger ratio versus cost situation. Eventually they will have eliminated everything that made cruising a unique experience. I cruised because I wanted to feel a little extra special, you know live like the other half once in awhile. Now the people with the coolers and Bud bottles want to cruise BUT they don't want to have a unique experience merely the same experience on water. The cruislines in attempting to fulfill those passengers dreams of CHEAP cruising have cut left and right until most of the frills are already gone. Well I wish the lines luck because most of the people I know that ***** and moan about having to wear a tie, some shoes for that matter, cruise about once every ten years or so.
Every year the cruise propaganda looks at only 1 percent of the American public cruising and determines that there is some huge market, ever expanding, out there. WRONG, there is a reason that the percentage is small, because many like other types of vacations. Yes by modifying the product they may increase the group a little more but certainly not by what they kept building for. In the meantime dedicated cruiseaholics are getting more and more unhappy with the product and looking for relpacement vacations. I sail twice a year minimum and for the first time in years I have nothing booked for 2002. I'm not saying I won't cruise this year just that I am looking at alternatives. WHY, because I don't want to cruise with the picnic cooler, long neck crowd if they wish to be the picnic long neck crowd while cruising. Yes the having pizza is nice, I am a pizza fanatic so are many, this is probably why there are ten pizza joints within two miles of anyone's house. YES Johny Rockets is great, love the one in my Mall, didn't really need one on the ship.
Yes get rid of the wine stewards, midnight buffets, use less staff and worse trained staff, become just like Adventure park, I guess I'll save a ton of cruise vacation money. In the meantime see if the sockless crowd pays the bills.
Okay I'm ready for the onslaught, come get me. I said it, wear the dam suit, actually have a nice dinner every night with the same people, and pretend you have some social graces for a WHOLE week OR get off my ships. Go take the trailer park vacation you always dreamed of. Guzzle the beer, fart around the camp fire and basically enjoy the heck out of yourself ON LAND.
PS : There is nothing more whimpy, whiny than a guy that has to p--- and moan " waw do I really have to wear a jacket waw waw waw. " And personally I love woman that want to wear their halter top to dinner, My kind of broad especially around 3 am at the local joint.
If you want to dress, eat, and live casual great, but why on a vacation that is not geared for that?
Yep cruiselines, go get them " you mean it's $599 PER PERSON? Oh my God and you have to pay for the POP? "
And, gosh, Cruzetime, there are people in this world who don't fart?
This is a very dynamic time in the cruise industry. As a patient follower (and avid cruiser) I see many changes. There are so many politically incorrect things to say, I can't even begin to count them.
I'll put my chin out there with George's and folks can beat BOTH of us up.
The fact of the matter is that $500 for a cruise is different than $5000 for a cruise. If one chooses to cruise on a ship where there are $500 cabins and you're in the top suite -- be prepared for whom you will meet.
And, to get even worse, you won't find the same crowd at Nordstrom's that you find at Wal-Mart (unless it's me and other like me looking for a bargain.).
When cruises are sold at Wal-Mart prices, except to find the same sort of folks you'd find at Wal-Mart and be prepared to live with it or else, cruise at the Nordstrom's (or Neimann-Marcus) rates on the premium lines.
It is, in my opinion, wrong for people to look down upon the bargain-basement price people IF they behave themselves and don't get into the long-neck, beer cooler attitude and abide by the ship's rules and recommendations.
I've met more plumbers that I respect than, maybe, lawyers. And they charge more, too !!! (That would be the plumbers.)
And I'm pretty certain that there are a lot of plumbers who are a lot better-behaved than some people who "put on side", look down upon others, and generally think they are hot stuff.
I chose this years cruise based on MY desires. We chose NCL specifically for Freestyle programs. Last year we were on Millie and dressed formally twice. The formal nights do not enhance the cruise for us, so we chose to do differently.
The cruise industry has become Americanized, which means less Continental, hence less formal. As long as there are cruise products for many different tastes, I will continue to cruise and experience different cruiselines. To date my favorite is Grand Princess because of all the options she offers me.
I do not let the appearance of others affect my cruise experience in any way. I don't care if they dress or not, that is their vacation and their options.
This cruise we were in the Owners Suite, not a $500 cabin (I can't remember the last $500 cabin we had, if ever) and not dining with other people made for a much more romantic and intimate cruise. Our liquor was on the house most of the cruise, and we didn't take advantage of it although we went through many 6 packs of diet coke and bottles of water. No, we did not pay anywhere near full price. we booked a balcony cabin 10 months in advance, and in August we got a call from NCL, for $800 extra we were upgraded.
I just don't understand why people feel that their cruise is harmed by the appearance of others. Yes, there are extremes, but that is not the norm. the only time you will get other pax who paid the same as you is on Radisson in an all suite ship, and then there are difference. Silver Seas which is all-suite has huge differences in price, and BTW, no formal nights at all and all open seating!
There are things in George's writing of which I completely agree. There is a certain mentality out there in cruiseland that says since I'm on a cheap cruise, I can behave cheaply. But I guess that's what you get when you pay Motel 6 prices. Believe me, you won't see society's "A" list cruising on the long neck, married to my cousin cruise lines. But, I go to Wal Mart, and I know that when I'm on a cruise I don't wear my tube top and hot pants to formal night. I know I'll quit cruising when I see those guys from Indy in the Snake Pit who yell, "show us your -its" to every woman who passes by. Now can you just picture that on a Silversea cruise? We had a good ol boy on one recent cruise as a dinner partner who would pick up his dessert plate and lick it clean every night. Heck, at least he kept his pinky up.
You do know that Sams Club is Wal-Mart. I don't apreciate seeing certain things here on land, so why would I want to see them on my "get away from it all, vacation?) Dirty feet, people eating and sucking the food off their fingers, blowing their nose at the table, picking their nose.....so, it really doesn't matter how much money you make or what kind of job you have....either you know how to act (and dress) for the occasion or you don't. Much of what is being said for the "kinds of people" that are cruising, I have been saying about those that can afford to visit the "parks" here in Central Florida. It's like everyone can afford to do it now because they don't have to buy new cloths or decent shoes. Just where flip flops, old t-shirt, bathing suit top, bare feet, ( and this is not around the pool) no need for soap or deordorant (hey, we were in the pool), etc.....
Blowing noses, Farting and dirty fingers. Definately Provincial. I'm glad I eat alone with my wife and sons. I am going to say this one more time. If you can afford a cruise, spend some money and buy a suit or two. I hate the lack of manners that some people have today. A tea shirt in the dinning room is gross! You got to be a real slob to go that low. But I must say the one thing that really gets me are those macho guys that must walk around the ship with no shirt on and their guts hanging down. I rather wear a shirt to hide mine.
I was told that Carnival is "the Walmart of the Cruise Industry." Last year my friends and I sailed to the western carribbean aboard the Carnival Triumph.
I must say that the trip exceeded our expectations. Most everyone was well attired and behaved. Since our cruise was not in prime vacation time, there were few children and the rowdy college crowd wasn't within shouting distance.
HOPEFULLY, the trailor park, beer toting, "it's my vacation, I'll wear what I want", moaners will soon be reduced in numbers.
It appears to me that many of the bargain basement fares are slowly disappearing.
Travel does seem to be returning gradually to pre 911 levels....of course, that still leaves the over-capacity of cruise cabins to be dealt with.
I agree with alot of what George said and as someone who is always in a Suite on HAL, I most assuredly have seen the different demographic among SOME of my fellow cruisers. As the prices crrep back up, I think they will creep back to their previous form of vacation. They cannot (will not) pay realistic cruise prices.
I am aware I sound very snobbish in this post....but I AM NOT a snob. Just tired of having the quiet enjoyment of my dinner ruined by SOME who have never vacationed in something resembling luxury and have no decorum or manners. Giant generalization here...but nevertheless true of enough brand new to cruising pax that they do effect the general experience aboard the ship.
Take a look at your local Macy's, Filenes or other dept store and then at a Target, tell me which is cleaner. Target's clothes here are at least folded and hung, A dept store's during a "one day sale" are on the floor. Want an adventure? Venture into any woman's fitting room at your local Dept store. So called "ladies" leave their garbage everywhere for the rest of us to climb over. Seems to me Target cares more about their customers. Some "trash" is just more expensive than others and that applies to cruise passengers as well. You don't know who you'll be with till you get there. The worst fellow passenger I can recall on any of the 5 cruises I've taken was a cratchety elderly lady who had a lot to say about everyone, extremely ill mannered and inconsiderate of those around her. She didn't look like she was shopping the dog food aisle at the supermarket, unless of course she had a $10,000 pooch at home.
As for Nieman Marcus, maybe the reason we can afford a $5000 dollar cruise once or twice a year is because our wardrobe is not made up of $175 tee shirts and $50 a pair undies.
Yes, the dress up experience is something to look forward to, and a great chance for nice family pictures. I don't want to give that up or the midnight buffet. I really missed that last year on Princess. Enough passengers complain, things will start to go back to the way they were. Lines experiment, if an experiment fails, they can it.
Money is not the guage and I doubt many think it is. We kiddingly refer to Walmart, there is nothing wrong with Walmart and I certainly shop there a couple of times a week. I enjoy paying three dollars less for my sinutab or underwear just like everyone else. The real question is not money but common sense. Would I go to the local Firehouse clambate in a suit and tie, of course not. The event is a very casual one, I know that and dress accordingly. Would I go to Great Adventure and wear a suit? Would be inappropriately dressed for such a vacation. So why would someone choose to go on a cruise yet insist on wearing shorts and jeans when the events call for a more formal attire?
The argument: I pays my money I do as I want. Well I pay for my car, license and registration, yet I must observe the RULES of the road. I paid the same price for my house as my neigbors but this doe not entitle me to play loud music all night, throw garbage out the windows and such. Again I should observe the RULES of society and my neighborhood.
The argument: I dress up everyday and don't want to do it on vacation. Then choose a vacation where dressing to a proper norm is not expected. I wear jeans everyday, still I wouldn't go to a funeral or a wedding in them. I once wore a suit everday, still wore one when I cruised.
The argument: ME ME ME I'll do as I want. No you can't or at least should not and you know you don't. You don't go to the supermarket naked to shop even if you wuold like too, there are accepted norms. You don't wear a bikini to Church, accepted norms of behavior. Every moment of ours lives are goverened by accepted norms and societal behavior which veries by our location. Why would vacationing be different?
I don't believe I am a snob by evidencing my desire that cruise passengers adhere to the accepted norms of such a vacation. I would match my lifes hard luck story against any, yet fail to see why that would be an excuse for me to chuck societal rules.
I certainly operate in one fashion at a beer keg company picnic in the park that I would at an eveing dinner theatre, is that illogical, of course not.
George in NY
> forgot.....you, like some others here, equate class and good
> manners to the amount of money one has. So not only are you
> a snob but you are not a good judge of people.
what is wrong with following a few rules? i am a retired alabama police chief and army brat, fountain-ft.carson 1961-62 so rules were a part of my up bringing. i don't dress up because i prefer it. i do it because wife enjoys it.[ 36 yrs ] and if it makes her happy so be it. carnival made it with no smokeing, regal had nudist cruiseing a few times. whose to say someone won't come up with a sloppy only cruise non lovemaking 3 meals only but no farting, i think not. there is nothing funnier than a good fart in the right situation. get a large table and see if you can keep them and tables close to yours guessing WHO DID THAT!!!!!!! IN ALABAMA WE POOT, THATS WORSE THAN A NY FART. 5-2-02 poots a coming, i love a good mystery. maybe at your table.