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  #31 (permalink)  
Old June 26th, 2005, 03:51 PM
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Default Re: We can't afford----- so is it alright if we -----???

Hey my parents go on cruises but they are stingy as heck. But, they like good sh..it. They claim victory when they get a deal on something. They both drive benzes (how the hell do you pluralize that anyway), but every couple of years they give the poor salesperson a nervous breakdown when bargaining.

What I mean to say is that yes they nickle and dime, but at the end of the day, they don't hurt themselves to go on a cruise. I really believe that if you are trying to watch every penny you may not enjoy yourself fully on a cruise. There are so many things to do and see and buy that if you're hurtin for cash then maybe a different kind of vacation may give you more satisfaction. (not YOU but "you" like....in general).

I agree Paul some things aren't mandatory but you may be missing out if you don't do them. Again, YOU have been on many cruises, so it's no big deal if you don't do some of the stuff, often times I don't either if I'm just looking to chill, but the first timer etc. may really not do the whole cruise experience justice if they don't do some of the stuff they want to because of a limited budget, that's all.

Also, their (my parents) mindset is that if you can't afford to do something, don't do it. I share that mindset. They get satisfaction out of being frugal, but the person who doesn't do something but they really want to, but they CAN'T, -- that's no fun.

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Old June 26th, 2005, 04:19 PM
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Default Re: Re: We can't afford----- so is it alright if we -----???

I guess the difference on the single supplement is that hotel rates are based on the style of room whether there is 1 or 2 in the room ... some may charge extra for each additional person above that ...

Candy

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Old June 26th, 2005, 08:13 PM
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Default Re: We can't afford----- so is it alright if we -----???

<< I do still contend that single people should not complain about "single supplements" in most cases because land-based vacations are not similarly discounted for solo travelers either. Why expect the cruiselines to be any different? >>

What the person said about hotels makes sense, they are the same rate no matter how many people sleep in them. I agree that 200% cruise fare for a single is too much, though. They are not eating as much as 2 people. But the cruise lines argument is that they could sell that berth for that rate, so they deserve it.

However - I believe the best way for a single to travel (in general, because of supplements) is that they go on an organized singles trip - with a roommate. For me, cruising is MUCH more fun when you have someone to share it with. I have traveled on ships solo, as a single. It is not nearly as much fun as with a group (which is why our CruiseMates Cruises are fun, by the way. Making friends is a fun part of cruising).

<< I agree Paul some things aren't mandatory but you may be missing out if you don't do them, but the first timer may really not do the whole cruise experience justice if they don't do some of the stuff they want to because of a limited budget >>

Well, I must agree there. I do believe that it does not make sense to go someplace 1000s of miles away and miss something unique about the place just because it is expensive. You payed a lot of money to get there already, and you may never get another chance (unless you pay a lot of money again) so the time to do it is when you are there. That's a long way of saying "make the most of your vacation".

However - that is "if" you have the money. But if you only have so much money, and you have the opportunity to take a cruise at a good rate - I would still go because it is possible to go and still have a blast without spending a ton of money on the extras. I wouldn't say to someone "well, just don't go."

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Old June 26th, 2005, 08:57 PM
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Default Re: We can't afford----- so is it alright if we -----???

Yup, if that was the case, I would go too, in a heartbeat!

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Old June 27th, 2005, 07:02 PM
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Default Re: We can't afford----- so is it alright if we -----???

As far as single supplements go - I booked my last 4 cruises as a single and have never paid more than 50% of the double rate. My current booking was only 35% of the double rate. Please, let me know which cruiseline charges 200%, I will be sure to stay clear of them.

Jodi

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Old June 27th, 2005, 11:20 PM
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Default Re: We can't afford----- so is it alright if we -----???

I've never paid 200% either, Jody. I am going on my second HAL cruise and the others were Carnival and RCCL. On all 4, I have gone solo. I guess it is like everything else. It pays to know what you are looking for and shopping around.

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Old June 28th, 2005, 05:39 AM
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Default Re: We can't afford----- so is it alright if we -----???

I agree with both PapaBill and Paul. Perhaps if you cannot afford a cruise you should be staying home. However, I can afford a cruise and do go when I can. This upcoming trip on the Glory is something I am doing for Patty. Her circumstances are different than mine. I am willing to work 2 jobs to afford the cruise, she cannot. Normally I would have booked an oceanview or balcony room. To accommodate her I took an inside cabin, no big deal for me and I doubt she will notice the difference. I have been emailing tour companies for prices on shore tours, usually cheaper than the trips from the ship. I think Key West will just be a walking tour for us and a stop at Margaritaville. I think that regardless of our circumstances this trip we will have a great time. Yes we do both plan to tip at the least the $10 a day charge and more where we think the service warrants it. Patty worked up until this spring when she retired, she is 67. She saved half of her monthly checks just to have money for this trip. The airfare she paid for herself. I am very proud of her for that. I have worked very closely with the agency that provides for her and her guardian to make this a reality for her. When I approached her guardian about taking her on a cruise he was happy that she had this opportunity. He has bent over backwards to help her with the financing. I started looking for a reasonably priced cruise when the Glory B cruise came along. I took Patty aside and talked to her about the money and what she can do to help pay her way. She is provided a monthly check to use as she wants. She elected to put away half each month. She gave up going out to lunch with her friends and some of her weekly trips to the senior center for lunch.
Yes PapaBill, I agree with you about priorities, some things should come first. Paul, I agree with you on cutting costs to make a trip more affordable. Our needs are met and if we have to cut costs on the extras then so be it. We will at least have a great vacation together that we can enjoy.


Laura

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Old June 28th, 2005, 07:35 AM
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Default Re: We can't afford----- so is it alright if we -----???

Right on the mark PapaBill!!!! I love what u wrote about skipping the braces and music lessons and getting a Jaguar instead. CLassic. My DH and I are are 40-42 and able to cruise on a regular basis with our son. He still gets to take guitar lessons and we have a savings account for those darn braces he'll need
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Old June 28th, 2005, 07:43 AM
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Most of us certainly don't fall into the "person" who was the subject of this post. We know what we can afford and are keeping the trip within those constraints. We are responsible about your spending and have the basics covered .
My post was geared towards folks who flat out should not be cruising (young, old , short , tall makes no difference) because they cannot afford it and are not making ends meet on the basics. "No money for rent, car payments , clothes and food, but gotta have my vacation and get to that casino". Those were the folks I posted about.
In addition, this post was never about hidden costs or cruise companies luring folks with the idea of a cheap cruise that is not really cheap.
The vast majority of folks, some frugal some not , can still afford the vacation. I am expressing concern for folks who for whatever circumstance flat out cannot afford to vacation but do so anyway.
Anyway this post generated some very healthy thoughts and exchange of ideas.
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Old June 28th, 2005, 08:23 AM
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Default Re: We can't afford----- so is it alright if we -----???

A little off the subject but with the same reasoning---I get a big kick out of people who protest for more welare benefits, screaming they have no money for food, clothes, etc. as they are standing there with their 6 little kids, a cigarette hanging out of their mouths while wearing designer clothes. (I am speaking of Massachusetts right now--not sure about other states) If they quit smoking, stopped having kids and bought cheaper clothes they would have more money for these things. Thanks for letting me vent.

BTW-before anyone turns on me, I know that there are circumstances where people actually don't have money for important things. It's the people who abuse the system that I'm talking about.



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  #41 (permalink)  
Old June 28th, 2005, 11:10 AM
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Default Re: We can't afford----- so is it alright if we -----???

Cheryl, we have that system here in Canada. It is very bothersome when you think of the hours that you work, stress, etc, and sometimes (although minimal) time sacrifices with the kids and family, just to pay so much friggin money in taxes and see the "abuse" of the system by some (SOME) of these people.

We have people that live a better lifestyle on social assistance than actually working at minimum wage. A lot of those min wage jobs are taken by immigrants who will work the hours, work hard, and put their kids through school because they have a work ethic and have seen conditions in their country of origin that were brutal. A lot of them I see in my line of work also have too much pride to even think of going on assistance while being fully able to work.

We like to think we have a very morally sensible system here in Canada but it ain't perfect.
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Old June 28th, 2005, 11:12 AM
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Default Re: We can't afford----- so is it alright if we -----???

sorry, that post above was me. You know! Me!

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Old June 28th, 2005, 11:40 AM
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Default Re: We can't afford----- so is it alright if we -----???

Banker, along those lines, I read a post on these boards one day wherein a lady from Montreal complained that if the cost of her subsidized day-care went up, she wouldn't be able to afford her cruise on the QE2.

Priorities, folks, priorities. Any vacation is a luxury.

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Old June 28th, 2005, 11:49 AM
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Default Re: We can't afford----- so is it alright if we -----???

I have been around a lot longer than most of you.

When I was a kid , our lifestyle was certainly not as lavish as most of the people who are on welfare today. However, we were middle class and enjoyed what we had.

There was no television and health insurance in those days, and a family was lucky to have one clunker for the father to drive to work. There were no credit cards, so it was hard to get into debt other than mortgage or car payments.

Cruising on a trans-Atlantic liner was so unlikely that it wasn't even a dream.

If anyone yearns for the good old days, don't!
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Old June 28th, 2005, 04:36 PM
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Default Re: We can't afford----- so is it alright if we -----???

"If anyone yearns for the good old days, don't!"

Sorry, Paul I do sometimes if only for the people values and caring for your neighbour
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Old June 28th, 2005, 08:49 PM
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Default Re: Re: We can't afford----- so is it alright if we -----???

David, we still have some of that down here in Texas.
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Old June 28th, 2005, 09:12 PM
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Default Re: We can't afford----- so is it alright if we -----???

DavidB, dude you switch internet providers like I change my socks (about once a month)!!



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Old July 5th, 2005, 06:23 PM
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I am not a single welfare mother. I worked two jobs at one point- one just to have the Xtras you guys are talking about. I no longer have to do that, as I now make enough money to pay bills, take care of my child and have the Xtras. I have a masters degree and in school for another one. Don't knock people until you have walked in their shoes for a while and know how bad their feet must hurt during the day. I work with people who are mostly poor and I encourage them to scrimp and save all they can to take a vacation. Who says only RICH people can vacation? If that were the case, the vast majority of us would never go anywhere...
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Old July 6th, 2005, 05:19 AM
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I cruise (and vacation) at 34 because I can, because I save and because tomorrow is not promised. I refuse to wait for life "when I retire" while there's so much in Creation to see and be blessed with here and now.

I was at one point a single mother of one who began graduate school while 6 months pregnant across town with no car. I lived in poverty while in school until I found my internship and a job AND school.. and raised a kid who 11 years later scores post high school level in many subjects on standardized tests.

When I got married in 2003, we postponed our honeymoon until May of the next year to pay for my daughter's private school. Our honeymoon was my first cruise ever. And I budgeted. I found a shore excursion for us on our own in one port. We pre-rented the tux, we only purchased one thing of cruise pictures, batteries and paid the tips.. I spent NOTHING ELSE on the ship on that cruise. And I'm not obligated to spend what I did, I do so as my own choice.

I can understand the priorities comments, but the slow decline into the "Those darned welfare people" is a little elitist. Let's not act like poor people are the only ones with bad priorities. We live in a consumer driven society where bad choices abound. And let's not bash the young people who want to enjoy the beauty of God's creation on a cruise with their children while they are yet young. (Like me). Economic priority mistakes come in every community.

After all, our budget in my USA had a surplus until a millionaire took office.

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Old July 6th, 2005, 06:52 AM
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Default Re: We can't afford----- so is it alright if we -----???

Just4Kian, I think the hardships you have endured are very commendable. I believe that your hard work and sacrifices will pay off; they always do in the end.

I agree that poor people aren't the only ones making poor choices, it's just that wealthier people can afford to. I also think that you may have only spent a couple of hundred on your cruise, but I think that with a strict budget you may have missed out on some things that would have made your cruise even more memorable. Let's hope you got hooked anyway.

Our 1st cruise was our honeymoon too. I was fresh out of school and making 1/10th of what I do now,, and my wife was still in school. We did a 2 week med on the pacific princess (the old love boat) and went apesh..it with the excursions. You know how crazy that can get because we did a full day excursion in every port.

It was probably quite irresponsible for us to do that, because that money invested 9 years ago would pay for 5 such cruises today. But, in retrospect, we wouldn't have it any other way. It got us hooked on cruising (18 so far), and we do more cruises than land vacations now.

I think it's kinda like saving for a special occasion, going to a really nice restaurant, and then not ordering what you want but going for something cheaper because of budget. That's just my take on it!

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Old July 6th, 2005, 08:08 AM
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Hey folks, let's not go to extremes here. No one (at least not my origonal post) is bashing poor people, welfare recipients or hard working folks of any age. I commend those who persevere through hard times and also those with a responsible "live for now" attitude. No one is saying wait for retirement to cruise . I certainly did not.
Again for perspective. I had 3 kids at 23 years old. I supported them by working as many as 3 jobs at a time , often 7 days a week. We enjoyed life , but kept our expenses under control and our priorities , as far a we saw them, clearly in line. I had a child who spent as many as 140 days in a single year hospitalized. We paid our bills and enjoyed our children and focussed primarily on them for many years. As time, hard work and circumstances allowed we added cruise vacations to our activities. Possibly , we would have done this earlier if circumstances had allowed. They did not.
My kids saw the sights and enjoyed touring every state from Maine to Florida while growing up. They were denied little, and enjoyed much.
It was all done within the resonable financial means at the time however. Sure we saved and did special things. Some were a bit of a splurge. None however were at the sake of forgoing my routine financial responsibilities.
Cruise if you can travel if you can. That is great , commendable and advisable. But not if it means your kid doesn't get a warm coat this winter or the medical care they require.
Happy cruising to all.
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Old July 6th, 2005, 09:15 AM
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since when are music lessons a nesessity? sheeesh
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Old July 6th, 2005, 10:09 AM
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Again , a matter of ones perspectives. Music lessons provided my children with a skill they enjoyed learning , persuing and growing with. It provided them with an appreciation for music, settings for healthy social interaction (band, marching band, jazz bands, school musicals, church choir , musical competitions and more). They learned to study and focus on goals. They flat out enjoyed it. Necessary? , maybe not. More important than a cruise vacation for myself and my wife?, in our priorities ,yes.
Although all three of my children are prfessionals (Lawyer, accountant and school administrator) their educations were very well rounded and included music, arts, history, religion and more. All write exceptionally well, all have no fear of speaking in public ( due in part to many musical performances in public). They are all in long term relationships, all are responsible and hard working. All are excellent parents as well.
Finding ways to give them that grounding and sense of responsibility included music lessons.
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Old July 6th, 2005, 11:28 AM
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I agree with most of the posters here - when you have a young family it is important to provide as best you can for them and that includes music lessons, athletics and provision for higher education before you consider cruising for yourself. Whatever happened to family camping vacations, road trips (of course that was before gas prices went crazy).

Just an aside here - on our recent 27 day trip to the Mediterranean (including 14 day cruise) I noticed so many families travelling with really young children and babies - in most cases I noticed the children were pretty miserable - witness three younsters under the age of 5 (in the same family) who cried for the 7 hours on the plane ride home. I think young families really need to evaluate whether the vacation they have chosen is suitable for their young children. When we went on vacation with our children we dedicated ourselves to their having a good time because we rapidly discovered that if they were miserable, they would pretty well ensure we were too.

We also didn't start cruising until our late forties and now we cruise at least once a year mainly because we do our best to minimize costs. We use cards that accumulate travel or air mile points, we limit ourselves to one ship photo per trip, we only use shore excursions if that is the most convenient way to see the port and since we don't drink, our bar bill is nil. I only book a cruise if it is a really good deal and my guideline is usually around $100 per person a day. An example of what we saved in transportation costs from the port to Rome: ship transfer $85 per person, the train we took $6 per person - I could go on and on.

The one area that I NEVER go short on is tipping - we always tip the recommended amount or more - the crew deserves every penny and more.
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Old July 6th, 2005, 11:55 AM
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to stick to the original topic, our first cruise was in 1980, we had to wait until 1994 to cruise again. You have to set priorities and now that the kids are grown, we are the priority! <<<<BG>>>>
Happy Cruising!
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Old July 6th, 2005, 01:29 PM
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Banker, donít get me going re changing my ISP or the problems, I havenít. I actually only have one and that ISP is DSL thatís goes via Satellite. I get bounced off everything in the sky, one of these days Iím going to show up here as coming on having posted via China.

But back to reality

Some great and personal posts given above me. They make great reading and show that everyone does it in their own way, and no-one deprived. So I imagine do the penny pinchers, they see nothing wrong in their action

No real comment, but I appreciate the great and honest posts
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Old July 6th, 2005, 10:32 PM
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You pick and chose what you feel is the most important sacrifice as a parent. When I was young we did all our vacations at the KOA camp grounds in the south in the heat, because my parents had only enough money to do that kind of trip. But, we were gone for three weeks!!!! I remember thinking how much I hated that hot tent, and wished we would have stayed home. As a youngster, I thought, why don't we go for a week, and stay in a hotel? We can swim, and sleep in the a/c?? I kept thinking why go for three weeks? I thought, surely they have thought of the other option? one week in style or three weeks in the heat? So, guess who doesn't camp? ME! I go for less time on my vacations, but I go the way I want to. Now, to my mother in law, the thrill of the whole vacation, is to see what kind of bargains she can find along the way. This woman does thrift stores for clothes, and can shop at a regular store, but loves the hunt. To each their own. It is fun to read about others perspectives.

Rhonda
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Old July 8th, 2005, 08:07 AM
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I find it funny that people who have nothing better to do that watch and comment on other people. Talk about an arrogant attitude about what people can afford! I bet many of these people who you see onboard work hard for every penny just to enjoy the good life for one week. They are not as fortunate as you but what they don't deserve to have their character torn apart. They are probably the same people that work in the supermarkets you shop in everyday or other service jobs to which they receive little credit. To agree with such a horrible thing is be a snob. Maybe I have a bigger heart, or maybe I see the faces of the tenants who rent apartments and houses from my family. They are all good people, not one dishonest one in the bunch. Maybe they don't have the best clothes when they travel or can't afford a nice bottle of wine, but they are honest people and they do deserve a week away from the hardship of living.
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Old July 8th, 2005, 09:10 AM
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Familyman--while I agree with some of the things you stated, I have a problem with people who live way beyond their means, by choice, then expect to receive state/federal benefits to help them out. As I stated in an above post, watching the news and seeing welfare recipients cry about not having enough money for their large families, while dressed in designer clothes and smoking cigarettes, makes my blood boil. I work very hard at two jobs so that I can afford to survive, yet have a few nice trips now and then which I save for.

Growing up we were poor, yet my parents always found a way to show us how to fun without alot of money. Vacations were car trips with coolers packed with food, clothes were never the latest trend, but were always clean and neat. I even had a handmedown bike with only a rim on the front, no tire.

There is nothing wrong with taking trips as long as you don't complain about not having money for the things you need to survive--housing, electricity, food etc.



Post Edited (07-08-05 09:34)
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Old July 8th, 2005, 11:15 AM
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Family man,
you have missed the point . No one is putting down the less fortunate in anyway shape or form.
I can't speak for other posters , I can for myself. I am putting down no one. I am however questioning a lack of responsibility and priority on the part of some people.

Financial resources or circumstances aside. Not questioning the circumstances, just the priorities. Not questioning everyones right to enjoyment, everyones right to dream,
everyones right to success (in fact I wish it for all).

Let me give an example. I had a woman who worked for my company. She had five children. She often complained about an inability to meet their basic needs, could not always afford to keep her car running yet she spent $80 to $100 per week on a new hair do for herself. Priorities and responsibilities.

I have sold retail, was a member of United Steel Workers of America, assembled thousands of newspapers on weekends, clerked behind the counter of a stationary store. My wife has been a school cafeteria worker, a clerk in a department store, a file clerk in a library ,a monitor in a school cafeteria. No one is putting down hard working people at any economic level.
This thread is all about priorities and responsibilities. That's all. No one has torn apart anyone's character.
Yes your tennants DESERVE a week away from the hardships of living. No one denies that. However, if they or anyone else puts that "deserved" week away ahead of basic responsibilities like food, clothing, shelter, education then there is something wrong.
How would your family like it if one of your tennants told them they were skipping next months rent to take a cruise? Remember, they "deserve" the trip and they are hard working , good people.
This thread is all about "want" and "desire" being put ahead of "need" and "responsibility". That can happen at any economic level .
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