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  #31 (permalink)  
Old May 27th, 2009, 06:31 PM
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Babe Ruth

Maybe I misread you or you wrote something earlier that better explained your comment about your "ten dollars" quote, but absent that I am left no choice but to understand you were referring to the cost per passenger increasing by only $10 per diem per guest by making all beverages including alcohol inclusive is no where near possible today. And even if it were true, a LOT (read "tens of thousands" per voyage) of the revenue of mid level cruise line's, is generated from beverages. How then would they make up such a sizeable chunk of revenue? They'd have to increase the price of a cruise a commensurate amount to cover not the cost, but to keep commensurate profits such a change would engender? Such would undoubtedly result in across the board price increases that would significantly reduce the viability of a cruise for many folks.

And anyway, if it were so cheap or so popular, why didn't your friend do it on his cruise line? From what several of the folks on this thread imply, such a move would increase their business tremendously thereby resulting in more repeat customers and more sold out ships.

Believe me, if that were indeed the case, it would have been done years ago. And I'll only repeat; the number of cruisers has increased literally by the million over the past few years. Evidently, the industry is pretty viable, even in this depressed economy.

Just today, I found out that three employees of a local chain pharmacy here are going on cruises this summer; one next week, one in two weeks and another in a month. I was especially surprised that two of them cruise if not every year, every other year. I specifically asked them how they felt about increased drink prices, etc. Didn't seem to bother them a bit and two of these folks are simply retail employees and have nothing to do with the pharmacy. In short, they could not even be considered technically solid middle income in most areas of the country.

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  #32 (permalink)  
Old May 27th, 2009, 07:13 PM
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Let's look back , say 40 years or so ago. Cruise ships may not have been as "nice" back then, but they were smaller and had proportionately more service crew to serve the guests. They were not all inclusive (except for food and entertainment). But onboard "extras" were provided as services and not as profit centers, and were priced accordingly -- less than that charged on land. It was really a good system. The ships (or most of them) carried under 1000 guests (often many less) and certainly no more than 2000 guests. Thus shorter lines -- if any. This helped keep the guests' attitude good. The cabins weren't so great. For example, the "Love Boat" (old Pacific Princess) was rated poorly for honeymooners due to the fact that most cabins had two twin beds! Yet complaints and "gripes" were pretty minimal. Nobody was getting ripped off for high priced extras. No guest felt like he/she was "subsidizing" other guests because they either did or did not drink. And nobody came home grouchy from all the lines and mobs. Maybe the answer here is to be found in the past.
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  #33 (permalink)  
Old May 27th, 2009, 09:23 PM
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Babe Ruth,

I can't tell you about cruise ships in the late sixties, but I darn well can write with some authority about the cost of Transatlantic Voyages on the popular liners of the30's, 40's and 50's and when inflation is factored in.........well, let me put it this way; to travel in what would be a comensurate manner back then as we do today (even if you could), even a five or six day voyage would be absolutely out of the question for the average blue collar American. And what kind of space was there aboard? Well, place three thousand or so people on a ship of 40 to 50,000 GRT and you figure it out. Today, 3,400 is about average for a ship of around THREE TIMES that size. Oh and yes, drinks were extra back then as well.

Are things changing? Yes and in many cases, I hate also to see them change and I also don't like being nickeled and dimed to death. Do I also believe more of what's extra should be included with a commensurate increase in fares? I most certainly do. But and this is my opinion, that some folks are way out into left field somewhere, is when they make dire predictions on an industry (or faction thereof) based basically on something as subjective as cuisine or the price of a Mojito; that just ain't gonna' happen.

What may happen, is some lesser line will someday develop or one of today's mass market lines may evolve into what many of us, including the two of us, would like to see. If it works, everyone else will follow suit. If it doesn't, well then......we might enjoy it while it lasts.

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Old May 29th, 2009, 07:18 AM
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DayvidB,
I realize that the cruise industry is trying to suck me in with the cheaper prices and then making the big bucks on the extras they charge. I also realize that if I don't use the extras and thereby avoid those charges the cruise lines will have to hope someone else makes up the difference. So be it. Should I choose to pay a higher cost for things I don't intend to use just to satisfy the bottom line of the cruise industry?

As another example. The credit card industry. They make the majority of thier profits by people carrying a balance and additional fees, such as late fees. I use credit cards regularly. I enjoy the benefits suchs as cash back bonuses, free movie tickets, cruise line discounts and other perks. I do not, however, carry a balance or pay any additional fees. I let some other sucker pay for my largesses. Am I taking advantage? Perhaps. But the credit card indutry continues to try and get me to use my card, get new cards and increase my limits. They seem to enjoy me being a customer. So am I at fault in some way? Should I start racking up a big balance so I'm paying "my fair share"? I think not.

Same goes for the cruise industry. I am not making the rules, I am just learning to live by the rules the industry sets. If I can work those rules to my advantage that doesn't make me a criminal, does it?
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Old May 29th, 2009, 09:24 AM
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Okay - I've had some time to consider my snippy response regarding cheap prices at the warehouse clubs.

As some have already pointed out, you have to pay an annual fee to have the opportunity to save money.
The prices at these clubs are not necessarily the lowest on all items in the store, though they create the illusion that they do.
People go to the warehouse to purchase groceries but the groceries are located as far from the door as possible. You have the walk through lots of high priced bargains to get to what you came for
On weekend, at least, the clubs are full of "product demonstrators" pushing gold by the inch (I mean high sodium/high calorie foods)
On the way out you pass an array of additional services for offer.

I am a "member" of Costco so I'm not throwing stones. I'm just pointing out that warehouse clubs are not just get-in-get-in-get-out stores, they offer a huge number of products and services (including cruises) to separate you from your money.

And despite the success of Costco, Sam's, BJ's and others Sak's is still in business. If you don't like the CCL, RCCL, NCL model - sail RSSC.
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  #36 (permalink)  
Old May 29th, 2009, 04:52 PM
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Sorry, thats not a response regarding your point, its personal justification and you are still comparing apples and oranges....Why because PEOPLE feed and cloth themselves and the retailers you highlight offer them that, value and cheap.

Going on vacation, in fact the ability to go on vacation means you have moved up in "the money" and you have some to BURN.

SO, given you may have money to burn, does that give the people providing your vacation the RIGHT to rip you off because of that?

You see the people that buy the necessities from the places you quote, and given their circumstance and given budget would not get into the supplier’s principle and honour scheme if they did not think they had got value in buying there.

But because it’s the CRUISE industry, a lot of folk don’t look at the bigger picture of what it costs to be there, the cost of extras etc,,,and sorry you cannot compare the two, one is upfront cost and meets 365x7 needs in food and clothes, the other is gauged on disposable income reaction,,,throw away money.

There is your problem, the lines expect, deliver and price on what you have is "throw away" money. SO no questioning or expectation from the client,,we can charge what we like.

Sorry, but I have to agree with my learned friend Babe. The true age of cruising is when you could afford to pay the "entrance fee" to be there. After that you got all the benefits of being able to afford the entrance fee in the first place.
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Old May 30th, 2009, 06:38 AM
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Maybe I am misunderstanding the position you're taking, DavyidB, but let me sum up what I think you are saying. The only people that should be going on cruises should be able and willing to shell out the big bucks or not go at all.

Assuming that is your position, it fails to take into account one salient point. The cruise industry is not in business to enhance the lives of the rich and famous, the elite few. The cruise lines want to enhance -only- thier own bottom line. If they see a means of making more money by drawing in a larger crowd with discounts, added benefits, ice skating rinks, rock walls or free kazoos, they will do just that.

Personally, and I have stated this before in other threads, I feel the cruise industry making the means for us common folk to enjoy the wonders of crusieing is going to, in the long run, make the entire industry stronger.

As green_rd points out, their are many crusie lines offering many differnt levels of cruising. Each of us can take what suits us best, socially and economically and leave the rest for others. Just because RCCL or Disney manages to fill thier ships doesn't mean Carnival or NCL will not. It's not necessarily a zero sum game with every winner, a loser. many different lines can and do succeed.

I think there will always be many people that want, and will happily pay for, the very high end cruises. Just like there are people who will buy a Masertai. The bulk of the public can't afford the high end goods, but some always will.
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  #38 (permalink)  
Old May 30th, 2009, 03:35 PM
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thasic,
I'm with you. I do not feel any guilt at being smart enough with my money to work the system. I didn't set up the rules. And, if someone feels I should contribute to subsidizing the cruise lines' bottom line, I suddenly become deaf. Whether vacations or necessities, I look at prices and decide what to buy. And, that is my right. I find it ridiculous that someone thinks I should drink more so that they don't have to buy so many extras. Besides, I barf if I have more than 1 or 2 drinks. Gross, I know, but my point is that it is not anyone else's decision, it is mine!
Also, there was a time when only the wealthy could cruise. Now those days are gone and I am grateful for that. They would not continue to offer reasonably priced cruises if the system did not work in their favor.
Shutting up now.
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  #39 (permalink)  
Old May 30th, 2009, 08:31 PM
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DavidB, perhaps you are not familiar with the warehouse club, but it is not exactly full of the huddled masses.

Once you pay the final bill on most cruise lines you have no more required expenses. (I would argue the lines should pay their staff better so the passengers would not have to provide a gratuity, but that is not the way it is and I gladly tip. And that is a different discussion anyway.) I don't have to buy photographs, jewelry, alcohol, go to alternate dining venues or shore excursions. And I can still enjoy beautiful scenery, excellent shows, good food and a comfortable cabin.

What a bargain.
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Old May 31st, 2009, 04:32 PM
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I give in, you all win, your right and I'm sooooo wrong, its me that's got all this back to front, you caught me out well done.

You are asking me to respond to comments that I cant,,, and really I cant as I do not relate to how and what you post on ship costs and reality compared to life.

God,, how could I have been so stupid to even start thinking out of the box on here.

"DavidB, perhaps you are not familiar with the warehouse club"

Yip I am in all their forms across the globe

And actually what does this mean to you "Once you pay the final bill on most cruise lines you have no more required expenses"??

So I read that as, pay to go on and then dont spend another dime, resulting in a final SeaPass account that shows ZERO or near it for costs added for ANYTHING you bought or did on board, and after you have been on there for 7 or 10 days...mmm. If that is what you mean,,,game set and match to me as you just proved my point.
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Old June 3rd, 2009, 05:43 AM
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Look, big D, I think green RD is just saying that your final bill is, and should be, completly under your own control. If you wish to partake of numerous addons, your bill will be large. If you want a small bill, don't do a lot of extras. I don't really understand what your point is meant to be. Are you saying we, as consumers, should not have any choice in what the cruise industry requires us to pay for? Are you disagreeing with hwo or why the industry sets their prices? I just don't follow.
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Old June 3rd, 2009, 11:16 AM
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I have something to say here. My problem with cruise line pricing right now is they don't state the costs up front. You see pricing for $499 per person, however, that doesn't include port charges and taxes, fuel surcharge if oil is over $70 per barrel, Tips, cost to park your car if driving, airfare, cost of per cruise hotel, and transfers to and from the ship.

The problem with not knowing the "true" cost upfront is people who can't afford to cruise. Think they can because it's only $499 per person. They get on the ship and don't have the money to tip, buy any extras like liquor, bingo, photos, and shore excursions. These extras are how the cruise lines and cruise staff make money. If the cruise lines are going to charge auto tips, fuel surcharge, and port fee/taxes. Should include that information upfront instead of trying to "trick" people into booking.

DayvidB is right the cruiselines are encouaging people who can't afford a cruise to book one. I'm very careful with my money, however, I have never had a sail and sign card that was zero at the end of a cruise. My last cruise have been on Carnival so I start the cruise out with $10 per day per person on my sail and sign account. I know it will happen so I'm prepared for this. I just wish the other passengers were prepared for it to.
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Old June 3rd, 2009, 02:46 PM
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Oh no, Katlady! I can't believe I actually disagree with you on something. I do think that most people seem to drop all common sense about their first cruise. A good travel agent will make them aware of extra costs, but common sense should tell people that they have to pay to get to the port and the cruise documents and even ad's say that there are things that cost extra. SOmehow, I don't think the cruise line should have to take responsibility for educating everyone in detail. If you make reservations at an expensive restaraunt, you shouldn't be surprised at paying for valet parking, tipping, wine, dessert, whatever. Why people think that anything is ever going to be truly "all inclusive" is beyond me. Especially when it is spelled out even in the cruise brochures.
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Old June 3rd, 2009, 05:07 PM
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Thasic

What I am saying and some folks do get this. The price to get on board a ship today is actually a loss leader for them, i.e. that price most folks pay does not cover their costs.

SO, they get you on cheap and in their cabin. Only then when they have you onboard can they expect that they will begin to make money (or profit) on you.

How,,,, when YOU BUY anything or everything they have from drink to shore excursions or GAMBLE.

But if you go on and don’t spend what they expect an average person will spend on a 7 or 10 day cruise, then they have lost money on you being there, gamble lost.

Unlike before when it was once priced that their profit was already made up front on your ticket price and anything else gained in these “extras” was a bonus.

They are now taking a gamble that they can recoup the difference in onboard spending against cheap ticket prices. That’s why ticket prices for what was once an expensive vacation or the ability to cruise have now become so cheap.

That’s why I say people that go onboard and don’t spend a penny or maybe just a few bucks have not really paid for that cruise in the lines eyes and others that do are simply helping to subsidise them on the balance sheet.

This is not my flight of fancy or ideology, its fact in today’s bulk cruise industry and how they price to get folks onboard.
Is it wrong some folks do get this and know this is why they are on their so “cheap” and then happily except that “others” will go on and pay their price difference in how they as folks drink, gamble or buy,,,,,,YES

For those that do spend, and if "the real cost" was up front and "other" costs reasonably priced and before you come on board, and the line has already made its money,,,I'll bet their experience (including mine) would come out cheaper than it does today on the lines, that play this game.

Question: Ever heard of Silverseas or Seabourn, they are one of the few true lines left. Have a look at their prices for a 7, 10 or 21 day cruise,,,,its all up front, some would say those prices are luxury, I say pay it or dont come onboard. No hidden agenda there
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Old June 3rd, 2009, 07:05 PM
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What one has to do is to consider the fare plus the extras on the mass market ships, and compare that with the fare on all inclusive ships. Problem is, the price of the extras, and the things that are extra keep changing, so the "math" isn't that easy. Then, something has to be factored in for the less crowded, better serviced lux ship with larger rooms.

If one does not drink, gamble, or eat at "extra restaurants -- and does not mind crowds and small rooms, the mass market is a real bargain. For others, the "math" isn't that easy.
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Old June 4th, 2009, 09:41 AM
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I agree with Katlady partially. The port charges, government fees, etc. ought to be very clearly disclosed if not included in the advertised price. But I will side with Marty regarding expenses like airfare, pre/post-cruise hotels, parking and transfers. Certainly these are costs to take into consideration, but they will vary greatly. Perhaps cruiser A will stay in the Hyatt while cruiser B stays at the Days Inn. The lines can't anticipate your additional expenses. There was a strong chance that I would have gone on a cruise this past spring but I couldn't get decent airfare - maybe some cruise line should begin sailing Tuesday to Tuesday to align with the airlines lower fares

DavidB, I am beginning to see your concerns are more directed at the lines business model rather than the costs to cruisers. Is that right? I know that cruise lines have enormous fixed costs and incremental costs are pretty low. After all, does it cost the line more to have a balcony cabin cleaned than an inside cabin, or to feed the occupants of the same, no. So passengers who are enjoying the views from the balconies are also helping to pay the way for they comrades across the hall, in the same way the more active drinker helps pay the way for the teetotaler. (I have intentionally ignored suites as the amenities and level of service varies by cruise line in suites.)

Babe, I'll grant you the math is not easy and I think the cruise lines could give better guidance as what to expect that you might spend. For instance it seems excursions in Alaska are largely more expensive than in the Caribbean and Mexican Riviera. But when spending as much money as one does on a cruise the consumer must educate them selves. Just like making any other big ticket purchase.
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Old June 4th, 2009, 12:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by colorcrazie
Oh no, Katlady! I can't believe I actually disagree with you on something. I do think that most people seem to drop all common sense about their first cruise. A good travel agent will make them aware of extra costs, but common sense should tell people that they have to pay to get to the port and the cruise documents and even ad's say that there are things that cost extra. SOmehow, I don't think the cruise line should have to take responsibility for educating everyone in detail. If you make reservations at an expensive restaraunt, you shouldn't be surprised at paying for valet parking, tipping, wine, dessert, whatever. Why people think that anything is ever going to be truly "all inclusive" is beyond me. Especially when it is spelled out even in the cruise brochures.
Marty
It is strange that I disagree with you and agree with Dayvid. I normally agree with you. But this time he is right on with what he is saying.

Movie theaters also run this way. The movie is a loss leader, they are counting on people buying the overpriced sodas and popcorn (movie popcorn is sooo good). When someone sneaks in their own soda and doesn't buy one from the movie theater it hurts the theater.

For the cruise lines when the passengers sneak on liquor and don't buy drinks at the bar it hurts the cruise lines. The result is the cost of drinks goes up, so more people sneak liquor on board and we have a catch 22 situation.

The cost of a seven day Mexican Rivera cruise on Crystal Cruise lines is $2165, this price includes tips, all meals, liquor, and plus $500 ship board credit. The same cruise on Carnival Splendor is $659 and doesn't include tips, all meals (there are pay restuarants on board), liquor, port fees and taxes, fuel surcharge (if oil if over $70 per barrel). Once these cost are factored in the prices between the two become a lot closer. However, people only see $659 vs $2165 without considering the true cruise costs.
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Old June 4th, 2009, 01:51 PM
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I think, in summary, that the cruise lines are doing what a lot of businesses are doing, and that is to keep the customer confused sh he can't easily comparisson shop. They teach this technique in marketing classes in college. An example is one car dealer may have a certain car for $1000 less than a second dealer. But the first dealer charges $350 document fees, and the second charges $35 -- and the first dealer charges $900 more for the extended warranty.
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Old June 4th, 2009, 04:01 PM
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Yes, it is a technique that has been around for years. While I do agree that gov't taxes and fees should be included, it may be a while before that happens. I even recently saw an ad that did not include port charges. I would never book with someone who ignored that rule. But, the tips, alcohol excursions, etc. really shouldn't need to be explained, IMHO. We don't sneak booze on board because we rarely drink. So, for us, the price difference between Crystal and Carnival just isn't justified. I would rather have the choice to pay extra for specialty restaraunt or not. We always tip, so I just budget for that. But, even the $500 OBC wouldn't be that meaningful, unless we were going to a lot of ports that we were not familiar with and wanted to do ship's tours.
Oh, by the way, once in a great while, I do agree with Dayvid!

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Old June 4th, 2009, 05:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by colorcrazie
Yes, it is a technique that has been around for years. While I do agree that gov't taxes and fees should be included, it may be a while before that happens. I even recently saw an ad that did not include port charges. I would never book with someone who ignored that rule. But, the tips, alcohol excursions, etc. really shouldn't need to be explained, IMHO. We don't sneak booze on board because we rarely drink. So, for us, the price difference between Crystal and Carnival just isn't justified. I would rather have the choice to pay extra for specialty restaraunt or not. We always tip, so I just budget for that. But, even the $500 OBC wouldn't be that meaningful, unless we were going to a lot of ports that we were not familiar with and wanted to do ship's tours.
Oh, by the way, once in a great while, I do agree with Dayvid!

Marty
Sometimes our resistance is down and Dayvid makes a good point.

What about tips, that is other thing included in the Crystal price. Carnival automatically charges $10 per day per person. If the tips and port fees were added to the cost of the seven day cruise the cost goes to $659+70+(port fee estimate) 150= $879. To me this should be the base price of a cruise. The price should include stateroom, port fees, and tips. I agree some of the other things depend on the person. But if you and your spouse are thinking of taking a cruise for $1318 for both of you that isn't correct. The true price is really $1758.

A first time cruiser may feel tricked and cheated by that fact. We who have cruised for years understand the additional charges. Newbies don't, so what do you do when the cruise is suddenly $440 higher then you thought it would be? the only "opinional" charge on the list is auto tips. This is now the crew gets hurt by the marketing department not being upfront about the charges.

BTW the price per barrel of oil is very close to $70 dollars so fuel surcharges maybe reinstated soon.
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Old June 4th, 2009, 05:19 PM
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Quite true, but the lines make their fuel surcharges very prominent. Not so for the price of a drink!
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Old June 4th, 2009, 09:27 PM
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People still remember commericials like this that never explained "everything".

"There's Never A Bill?"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BECwNurBbEQ

Take care,
Mike
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  #53 (permalink)  
Old June 5th, 2009, 02:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by babe ruth
Quite true, but the lines make their fuel surcharges very prominent. Not so for the price of a drink!
Carnival tried to charged me a fuel surcharge on my TA cruise last year. However, they had to refund it because of a class action lawsuit. There hadn't been any fuel surcharges at the time I booked. I had no knowledge of a possible fuel surcharge. The cruise lines tried to sneak a fee in and got caught. That is the reason the website clearly state that if oil gets over $70 per barrel they will reinstate the fuel surcharge. That ways you ae notfied ahead of time and they won't lose another class action lawsuit. It was nice getting my fuel surcharge as ship board credit. It paid for the tips.
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  #54 (permalink)  
Old June 5th, 2009, 03:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike M
People still remember commericials like this that never explained "everything".

"There's Never A Bill?"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BECwNurBbEQ

Take care,
Mike
Her song even says, "not much money but oh honey ain't we got fun." That is an older commerical. This is a newer commerical and if you look closely, maybe you can see the tiny writing explaining the port fee and taxes. However, it doesn't say anything about the $10 per day per person in auto tips.
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  #55 (permalink)  
Old June 5th, 2009, 10:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by katlady
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike M
People still remember commericials like this that never explained "everything".

"There's Never A Bill?"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BECwNurBbEQ

Take care,
Mike
Her song even says, "not much money but oh honey ain't we got fun." That is an older commerical. This is a newer commerical and if you look closely, maybe you can see the tiny writing explaining the port fee and taxes. However, it doesn't say anything about the $10 per day per person in auto tips.
The tips are a dicey thing. You don't have to tip, but yeah, you should. The fact that tips show up on the bill (on most lines at least) is really an indication of that. But the lines can argue that they are voluntary.

Isn't it NCL that made tips mandatory? Mandatory tips are not tips, but that is a different thread.
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  #56 (permalink)  
Old June 5th, 2009, 02:32 PM
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About a year ago, Carnival was running a TV ad here saying "it's just like an all-inclusive resort that goes from place to place." Well, not quite, and the ad didn't stay around for long.
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Old June 5th, 2009, 03:13 PM
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Years ago, hubby talked me into going to one of those interval ownership hussles. I about drove the salesperson crazy because he kept saying that there was never a bill at the end your vacation. And I kept replying that it was because there was a bill every month.
But, I still stand by my statement that tips should be common sense. Of course, having said that, common sense isn't really common anymore, if it ever was.
Marty
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  #58 (permalink)  
Old June 5th, 2009, 03:31 PM
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Right, common sense. That is why when I buy a car I always ask about what the options are and how much, document fees, extended warranties, and everything I might want.

Trouble with cruises is that, unlike cars, I know of no way to find out how much drinks and such are.
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  #59 (permalink)  
Old June 5th, 2009, 04:20 PM
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Green_rd....let me break this down

"DavidB, I am beginning to see your concerns are more directed at the lines business model rather than the costs to cruisers. Is that right"?

They are both the same, one drives the other, you can’t separate them

"I know that cruise lines have enormous fixed costs and incremental costs are pretty low. After all, does it cost the line more to have a balcony cabin cleaned than an inside cabin"

No, and not my argument

"or to feed the occupants of the same, no"

No it does not and I agree

"So passengers who are enjoying the views from the balconies are also helping to pay the way for they comrades across the hall"

Yes, agreed up until the word hall, as it forms part of the original get on board costs

What you are missing is this, if its inside cabin, balcony or suite those prices are averaged across what the ship needs to take in across all those scenarios and passengers when it sails to gain the profit.

So in that theory, a person in an inside cabin per head could on board spend more per head than the person in a suite,,,confused, so am I.

But you also have to take into account all the stuff you said above about cleaning, food costs etc.

And given that, the person in the suite, even if they don’t spend another dime, have given it all up front in the cost of having that cabin amd in some scenarios 10x's what the inside person bought for the same ship, same food etc

You and others have questioned my thought process on this "actual cost V's real cost". SO I want to ask you and others that think like that a simple, dead easy question.

If no-one drank, gambled or bought what we see as "extras when onboard".... Would you expect the cruiselines to offer you that ship, that itinery, that cabin, that food,,,at the same price you see or get today?

If you are honest you will say no, if your dillusional you will say yes.

Its not a hard scenario to accept. put it this way. If the ship/line had already made its money on your ticket price TO SAIL, would they be so anal on bringing "drink" ONBOARD
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Old June 5th, 2009, 07:53 PM
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What about the solo's who pay as much as 200 percent of their fare?

please note; I am not complaining and understand the need to charge that way.

I just wanted to sigh, I guess.

Sweet Sailing!
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