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Old August 16th, 2010, 04:01 PM
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Default 'Dream' pax fight/removed from ship

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Old August 16th, 2010, 04:29 PM
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I'm not that shocked actually, I bet it was over sunbeds....''You moved my stuff'' sort of thing, if you get opposing people both arrogant enough to think that they have either the right to have any bed whether they are using it or not OR to take any bed they THINK they can removing personal effects as they do it.
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Old August 16th, 2010, 05:24 PM
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They must have dug deep for that person to interview. "This never happened on any other ship" (really?) "how did the ship ALLOW this to happen"? Sounds like a very immature interview.
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Old August 16th, 2010, 05:56 PM
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The ten passengers and an 11th companion were led off at the next port of call. The cruise line would not identify the people involved.
I wonder who the 11th person was. Could it have been a crew member?
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Old August 16th, 2010, 06:33 PM
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I bet nunber 11 was the guy at the back saying "Nah he ain't worth it"...
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Old August 16th, 2010, 07:08 PM
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You can bet your bippy there was loads of booze involved in this chaos!
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Old August 16th, 2010, 08:31 PM
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Here is a report from cruise junkie's site:

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From a passenger: We were on the Carnival Dream sailing 08/07 to 08/14 and heard that a brawl broke out in the dance club around 3:00 a.m. on the morning of the 12th. We heard from passengers and a bartender that the brawl started over a song. It involved so many young people (men and women) that the security on board was unable to handle everyone and had to call in assistance from wait staff and other crew members. The fight spilled over into the art gallery located next door and apparently a $10K painting was ruined with blood spatter. Flat screen tvs were smashed and there was a lot of damage done. We heard that people on the ground were getting kicked in the head by men and women and that one person needed to be revived because he was hurt so badly. We also heard that the crowd spilled out of the dance club and that innocent people were getting punched in the face as they were walking by. The next morning in Costa Maya there were a bunch of people sitting by the side of the ship with all of their luggage as they were kicked off the ship and their relatives were shipped off to Mexican jails. Carnival needs to learn a lesson here and not serve alcohol after a certain time and perhaps shut down the 18+ dance club before 3:00 a.m. Nothing good can come of drunk teenagers at 3:00 in the morning.
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Old August 16th, 2010, 09:46 PM
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Would this happen on Celebrity or Holland?
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Old August 16th, 2010, 10:27 PM
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It could happen on any line...kids with attitude, plus booze...you betcha
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Old August 17th, 2010, 08:14 AM
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Would this happen on Celebrity or Holland?
Money doesn't equal being smarter. Look at the baseball player who just lost his season for getting into a family fight at the stadium and injuring himself in the process.
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Old August 17th, 2010, 09:16 AM
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Worse than I thought...more than a bit of pushing & shoving, sounds very nasty. I thought it was only us 'Brits' that did this sort of thing....or so we are told. At risk of being shot at....this sort of thing seldom seems to happen with people who enjoy cruising for itself rather than just another holiday that happens to be on a ship.
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Old August 17th, 2010, 09:17 AM
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Money doesn't equal being smarter. Look at the baseball player who just lost his season for getting into a family fight at the stadium and injuring himself in the process.
I agree with that. However, I bet the odds of this happening on Carnival are higher than it happening on Cunard.
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Old August 17th, 2010, 11:13 AM
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Mark NYC,

Not defending Carnival here but you may be right. I believe however that the difference in prices for the two lines (Carnival vs Cunard) would probably rule out the same thing happening on a Cunard vessel. That being said, it has become the latest fashion to settle arguments with fists, guns and knives. And with alcohol as an added fuel it gets messy. I don't know what the cruise lines can do except enforce age limits in their bars. Last time I sailed (Mar 2010) Carnival Miracle seemed to have a handle on age limitations. I did see several waiters asking for IDs. Hope this is an isolated icident.
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Old August 17th, 2010, 11:32 AM
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''Non -PC'' I know, but I often think that all some obnoxious ignorant people DO understand is being knocked on their butt. Especially on a cruise, as these bullies KNOW that nobody would dare thump them because of the fear of getting kicked off, they wouldn't get away with it in real life.
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Old August 17th, 2010, 01:20 PM
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Serving alcohol past 3am isnt the point - serving alcohol to drunks is what should be addressed. Not just Carnival but all cruiselines.
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Old August 17th, 2010, 02:26 PM
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We're assuming alcohol was involved. I didn't see it in the report. Some people do need to be drunk to be stupid - but it helps.

I reread the report. I like how the "eyewitness" actually was reporting second hand information. That is top notch journalism for you.
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Old August 17th, 2010, 09:49 PM
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This was a sad event, but it could have happened in any cruise line. We have plenty of violence loving stupid people in this world. :-x

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Old August 17th, 2010, 11:30 PM
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I don't recall seeing alcohol mentioned either but more than likely it was involved. I do believe that any cruise line should shut down the bars by 1a.m. or so rather than keep them open til 3 a.m.--that's just asking for trouble.
But as far as Carnival or any other line " cutting off the drunks " that would in itself just start a fight --if some ignoramus was already drunk and no one would serve him another beer or drink, just think what a scene that could cause.
BUT--here's the problem with cutting off the drunks--- how many times do you see over and over and over people asking for advice on how to smuggle alcohol aboard a ship,and as soon as they ask the question there's a dozen people ready, willing and able to tell them a dozen ways to smuggle it aboard. So, cutting off the drunks at the bar probably wouldn't work, as more and more would just smuggle it aboard,. If an idiot wants to get drunk and start a fight, they'll do it whether they buy it from Carnival or whether they have it stashed in their cabin.
There's just simply been a break down of manners in our society and most anyone can see that. With all the ships that's been built and are being built, more and more people cruise, which means that you have more and more of a mix of society that take cruises, therefore you'll find more and more who think nothing of acting like an idiot when they're aboard because they probably act that way at home too.
'Cuse me while I lurch to the kitchen fer a nuther cold beer.
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Old August 18th, 2010, 04:41 AM
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Mark NYC,

Not defending Carnival here but you may be right. I believe however that the difference in prices for the two lines (Carnival vs Cunard) would probably rule out the same thing happening on a Cunard vessel. That being said, it has become the latest fashion to settle arguments with fists, guns and knives. And with alcohol as an added fuel it gets messy. I don't know what the cruise lines can do except enforce age limits in their bars. Last time I sailed (Mar 2010) Carnival Miracle seemed to have a handle on age limitations. I did see several waiters asking for IDs. Hope this is an isolated icident.
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I agree with that. However, I bet the odds of this happening on Carnival are higher than it happening on Cunard.
I enjoy those with the mentality that feel that the "cost" of a vacation is a direct reflection of "class." Having worked in several hotels and resorts, from 1 star up to and including 5 star, I know first hand that the cost of the hotel (cruise in this case) has no bearing on how a person will act.

It is way to easy to generalize then to look at this an isolated incident.

If, however, you are saying it would not happen on Cunard as a direct reflection of them not having any venues open at 3am, then you may be correct in your assumtion.
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Old August 18th, 2010, 08:41 AM
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Well. I wasn't really thinking "class/cost of cruise" here. What I should have said, rather than "cost of cruise" was "age difference" on the 2 lines. Surely one must agree that Cunard doesn't have the same passenger demographics that Carnival does. Bottom line for me: that kind of behavior is totally unacceptable. And if anyone has the answer to prevent this, I'd like to hear it. I am really tired of a few rotton individuals causing problems for the vast majority of folks who like to cruise.
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Old August 18th, 2010, 10:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Master Chief View Post
Well. I wasn't really thinking "class/cost of cruise" here. What I should have said, rather than "cost of cruise" was "age difference" on the 2 lines. Surely one must agree that Cunard doesn't have the same passenger demographics that Carnival does. Bottom line for me: that kind of behavior is totally unacceptable. And if anyone has the answer to prevent this, I'd like to hear it. I am really tired of a few rotton individuals causing problems for the vast majority of folks who like to cruise.
I wasn't thinking of cost either. I enjoy the mentality of people who make assumptions and have low reading comprehension.
The fact, like it or not, is that Cunard generally attracts a different demographic and level of sophistication than Carnival. Now, I know this will raise ire, but I used the word "generally". That is a word with an actual meaning - let's see if you actually get it.
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Old August 18th, 2010, 11:12 AM
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I absolutely hate reading about this kind of thing. Its supposed to be a vacation and then others are injured and property is ruined...

Yep, Trip, you were right, booze was involved, how sad. Plus, it was over a song??
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Old August 18th, 2010, 11:56 AM
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Ron,

I have to disagree with you on closing the bars early (1am). For the people at late seating, or the people who just are night owls and on vacation so they like to be out late - this just isn't fair. I've seen people dancing until way after 1am - having a great time. Isn't that why some of us take a cruise?

I know alcohol wasn't mentioned, but I'm thinking it was involved. And you are correct - shutting someone off in the bar is not always a guarantee that they won't go back to the cabin and drink booze brought on board. But I got the feeling reading the article that the people involved were drinking where the fight happened.

And drunks get shut off in every day on loand - without problems happening. I think it should not matter if you're on vacation - if you're bombed - the bar should shut you down.
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Old August 18th, 2010, 12:34 PM
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Wow I was on the ship the week before.
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Old August 18th, 2010, 01:23 PM
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Sista, I do have to agree about the late diners-- I hadn't given that any thought--getting out of the dining room around 10 or so and then closing the bars at 1 wouldn't give them much time to dance off all that grease !!
But, on the positive side, if you look at the large numbers of people who cruise and the small number of incidents, it doesn't seem to bad but surely people could have a better time without getting drunk and fighting.
But, I have to be honest and say too, when I was young and in the Army, getting drunk and into fights in a bar certainly wasn't unheard of !! :???:
Now that I'm too old to get into bar fights, I look at it differently !!
I try to keep a low profile now so my wife won't have to beat anyone up on my behalf !!
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Old August 18th, 2010, 08:05 PM
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Let the drunks fight themselves as long as nobody gets hurt, and then when they go to jail they can sing crying in their beer songs where they belong. $$$$$$ is what they should pay for the damage and,PERMANENTLY BAN THEN FROM ANY CARNIVAL CRUISE LINE

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Old August 19th, 2010, 12:28 PM
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Ron, that's an excellent point - the number of really drunk people I've seen on cruises has been small, thankfully.
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Old August 19th, 2010, 02:11 PM
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Does it matter if it would happen on another cruise line?

The chances that I would be in any nightclub on any cruise line at 3:00 in the morning are next to zero.

As long as I lock my door at night - why would I care even if it happened on my ship. I would be in bed.

My only surprise is that people like this (supposedly gang members) would ever take a cruise in the first place. I have been on a lot of cruises and I really don't recall ever seeing any "bangers" hanging around.

This just seems like a really weird anomaly to me.
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Old August 19th, 2010, 03:32 PM
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Does it matter if it would happen on another cruise line?

The chances that I would be in any nightclub on any cruise line at 3:00 in the morning are next to zero.

As long as I lock my door at night - why would I care even if it happened on my ship. I would be in bed.

My only surprise is that people like this (supposedly gang members) would ever take a cruise in the first place. I have been on a lot of cruises and I really don't recall ever seeing any "bangers" hanging around.

This just seems like a really weird anomaly to me.
I think it probably does matter. I would guess that these individuals were likely unpleasant at other times and in other venues on the ship. So while you might not end up in the middle of a brawl, you might encounter them on a deck, during a show, or in a restaurant.
I have cruised with Carnival, Holland America, Celebrity, Star Clipper, and Cunard. I can easily say that I have run into more drunk/rowdy/rude/uncontrolled people on Carnival sailings than I have on other lines. Therefore, I choose to hedge my bets and sail with more upscale lines. Does that mean I won't encounter jerks like this? No. Are my odds better that I will avoid them? I think so.
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Old August 19th, 2010, 05:09 PM
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Mark...

No doubt you are right about who cruises on what cruise line, but I tend to look at it like any big city. I might see drunk or unsightly people any day at any time, but it doesn't affect me personally.

Carnival may have a few people like this on some cruises, but I would never say this is the normal Carnival cruise passenger. So, this would not stop me from taking a Carnival cruise again.

I don't cruise based on who my fellow passengers will be, I cruise based on what kind of adventure I want for myself. But that's me. I also liked living in NY City and could ignore the homeless, etc. Not everyone is like me, some people are affected more.
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